[Feature] Tagging by Software

In category: Site Bug Reports & Feature Requests

Requested feature overview description.
A new type of tag, in a new color, where people can tag the software that was used to create an image.

What this would look like

Why would it be useful?
Many users already try to tag art with the software used to make it (especially when it comes to 3D models). As such, you'll find tags for Blender (mostly removed due to TWYS), SFM, and probably others. There are thousands of posts tagged in this manner, yet the tags almost never apply under the current system because you can't see blender or other software in the image.

However, there is a distinct difference in quality in images using different programs, in many cases.

Examples:

Here's some (safe) recent posts using Source Filmmaker
3d_(artwork) absurd_res blue_eyes blue_hair crown digital_media_(artwork) doctor-sfm equine eyewear female friendship_is_magic glasses hair hi_res horn mammal my_little_pony poster princess_celestia_(mlp) princess_luna_(mlp) source_filmmaker tongue tongue_out winged_unicorn wings

Rating: Safe
Score: 15
User: 2DUK
Date: July 08, 2018 ANIM3d_(artwork) ambiguous_gender animated digital_media_(artwork) doom doom_guy duo ear_twitch equine female feral fishimira friendship_is_magic hair horn human mammal my_little_pony petting smile solo_focus source_filmmaker trixie_(mlp) unicorn video_games

Rating: Safe
Score: 44
User: Fishimira
Date: July 06, 2018 3d_(artwork) aliasing blue_eyes canine digimon digimon_(species) digital_media_(artwork) female half-closed_eyes mammal petting renamon smile smoaer solo_focus source_filmmaker

Rating: Safe
Score: 12
User: Smoaer
Date: June 27, 2018

Here's the most recent posts using Daz3D:
3d_(artwork) breasts centaur daz3d dazstudio digital_media_(artwork) duo equine equine_taur female female/female hair hi_res mammal mythical nipples nude outside short_hair taur xlef

Rating: Questionable
Score: 2
User: xlef
Date: June 21, 2018 3d_(artwork) animal_humanoid avian avian_humanoid breasts daz3d dazstudio digital_media_(artwork) female group hair harpy hi_res humanoid monster_girl_(genre) mythical nipples nude short_hair xlef

Rating: Questionable
Score: 0
User: xlef
Date: June 21, 2018 3d_(artwork) amphibian animal_humanoid breasts daz3d dazstudio digital_media_(artwork) duo female frog_humanoid hair hi_res humanoid hybrid marine merfolk nipples nude short_hair xlef

Rating: Questionable
Score: 0
User: xlef
Date: June 21, 2018

Here's some (safe) recent posts using Blender:
3d_(artwork) anthro butt_pose clothing digital_media_(artwork) disney female hand_on_butt judy_hopps lagomorph mammal nocturnalfuzz police rabbit solo standing toeless_legwear uniform zootopia

Rating: Safe
Score: 14
User: nocturnalfuzz
Date: July 10, 2018 WEBM3d_(artwork) <30_second_webm animated anthro blinking close-up digital_media_(artwork) disney female fur grey_fur judy_hopps lagomorph mammal no_sound purple_eyes rabbit rubber_(artist) smile solo white_fur zootopia

Rating: Safe
Score: 12
User: rubber
Date: July 07, 2018 WEBM3d_(artwork) animated anthro bovine clothing digital_media_(artwork) farmer fur hair kemonokun mammal minotaur solo turntable_(animation)

Rating: Safe
Score: 6
User: Kemonokun
Date: July 05, 2018

As you can see, there are pretty significant differences in style and quality based on the 3D modeling programs used to create the artwork. I personally like looking for 3D models, but I'm not really interested in the type of quality that comes from SFM.

Right now, an overwhelming majority of SFM posts are incorrectly tagged as they do not fit the "Tag What You See" profile. Recently, almost all posts tagged with Blender had the tag removed for the same reason (mostly by myself and an admin), but I feel as though these tags could be very useful under the right tag type.

From the standpoint of searches (which is what tagging is all about), we tag artists as often as possible, even when they're never in the picture. I feel that for the purpose of searches, it makes sense to have a "software" or "medium" category so we can actually sort posts in a more effective manner.

What part(s) of the site page(s) are affected?
Mainly the tagging / searching.


Honestly this sounds like a neat idea! Having a "medium" category of tags sounds rly useful; for the most part, it'd mostly just involve moving already existing tags into the medium category (digital drawing, pencil (artwork), etc etc)

I don't see a downside to this imho; it would help, for example, people trying to specifically avoid or find things like SFM content within the broad 3D artwork tag.


I'm skeptical, principally because you have shown examples of software that *are* relatively distinct, but there are many others that aren't distinct.

Basically all 2d paint programs cannot be reliably distinguished. Like, we can tell the difference between Paint and Photoshop, probably ;) But we can't tell the difference between MyPaint and Photoshop, GIMP and Photoshop, SAI and MyPaint, etc. This is because 99% of the difference in appearance comes from *how* the artist uses the software, not *what* the software specifically is. So tagging 2d software would definitely require off-site information (as opposed to 3d software, which might *sometimes require* offsite verification).

Even distinguishing one 3d program from another is fuzzy -- you don't "identify blender" so much as "determine it doesn't look like SFM or Daz3d" (In which case it could still be Maya or some more obscure modelling program. And a modeller like Blender can be hooked up to different renderers (eg. Yafray), the choice of renderer creates further subdivisions within the area of 'image feel')

One way of resolving that -- which I'm not happy with, but I am slightly more happy with than your solution -- is to extract program information from the image metadata. That is as close as possible to TWYS -- like resolution tags, it uses information that is definitively indicated by the image, even if you can't directly see it.
The downside of that is that it would be the artist's responsibility to ensure their images are correctly marked. Some programs do this automatically, some don't, so some manual intervention might be required. If the artist didn't include the information in-file, we wouldn't get to add it.


savageorange said:
I'm skeptical, principally because you have shown examples of software that *are* relatively distinct, but there are many others that aren't distinct.

Basically all 2d paint programs cannot be reliably distinguished. Like, we can tell the difference between Paint and Photoshop, probably ;) But we can't tell the difference between MyPaint and Photoshop, GIMP and Photoshop, SAI and MyPaint, etc. This is because 99% of the difference in appearance comes from *how* the artist uses the software, not *what* the software specifically is. So tagging 2d software would definitely require off-site information (as opposed to 3d software, which might *sometimes require* offsite verification).

Even distinguishing one 3d program from another is fuzzy -- you don't "identify blender" so much as "determine it doesn't look like SFM or Daz3d" (In which case it could still be Maya or some more obscure modelling program. And a modeller like Blender can be hooked up to different renderers (eg. Yafray), the choice of renderer creates further subdivisions within the area of 'image feel')

One way of resolving that -- which I'm not happy with, but I am slightly more happy with than your solution -- is to extract program information from the image metadata. That is as close as possible to TWYS -- like resolution tags, it uses information that is definitively indicated by the image, even if you can't directly see it.
The downside of that is that it would be the artist's responsibility to ensure their images are correctly marked. Some programs do this automatically, some don't, so some manual intervention might be required. If the artist didn't include the information in-file, we wouldn't get to add it.

TL;DR I'm all for it.

In that case, some users, like myself, would have to take the time to look up the artist and see what program they use (which is pretty easy because most just outright list it) and most of those artists aren't going to jump between Blender/Maya/3DS which look similar. Most just pick one and stick with it (unless they're switching from SFM to Blender/Maya/3DS in which case it's obvious to tell which is which.

I'm all for it, because you can now search for what you like within the quite massive >28k 3D library with SFM taking up a good 1/3 and that's just what's tagged as SFM. Speaking of, I should go through and tag SFM stuff as SFM. Would be easier if the Blender tag was there so I could filter all of those out. 115 pages is daunting.


If we implement this, It would be nice to expand this to also cover traditional media as well. We have tags for those already.


SnowWolf said:
If we implement this, It would be nice to expand this to also cover traditional media as well. We have tags for those already.

Exactly what I was thinking! It'd be easy to move those over imho since they're already existing and pretty detailed, they'd just need to be put into their own "medium" sections.

leomole
Privileged
5 months ago
2014 anthro bottle bottomless cat chair clothed clothing computer desk feline fur girly headphones hoodie inside jailbird leaning leaning_back legwear liam looking_at_viewer looking_back male mammal reclining sitting smile socks solo tan_fur

Rating: Safe
Score: 138
User: Onii-chan
Date: May 09, 2014

+1 new tag type: media type (line_art, 3D, SFM, etc)


leomole said:
+1 new tag type: media type (line_art, 3D, SFM, etc)

If you include line_art (which is not 'media' [eg. pencil, charcoal, ink, mixed, digital] so much as 'artistic restrictions'), are you also going to include "palette format" tags like greyscale and monochrome?
What about hi_res / absurd_res? animated?

Personally I would be in favor of all of those being included, we need to be clear about exactly what will be included though.

BDAnimare said:
TL;DR I'm all for it.

It looks like you are saying that you are all for the original proposal. While quoting my post in its entirety, which contains a competing proposal (put the responsibility of specifying the software used onto the artist, rather than requiring taggers to do this after the fact).

Is that correct? I found your post ambiguous.


savageorange said:

It looks like you are saying that you are all for the original proposal. While quoting my post in its entirety, which contains a competing proposal (put the responsibility of specifying the software used onto the artist, rather than requiring taggers to do this after the fact).

Is that correct? I found your post ambiguous.

Yeah, that's correct. Of course, I myself would still go take what I know is sfm/blender/maya etc but it would still be up to the artist to tag the medium.

leomole said:
+1 new tag type: media type (line_art, 3D, SFM, etc)

That's not really the original discussion (though media type would be nice) We need a way to be able to tag stuff like blender, daz, maya etc so sfm stuff doesn't always pop up for those who don't want to see it.


Eh, blender is like 3ds max/etc. It would be the same as tagging Photoshop for images drawn in Photoshop vwhich would be very redundant.
The reason we have sfm and daz3d tags is because these are often of low quality(high enough to meet quality standards but low enough to look bad).
Personally I feel we shouldn't allow sfm art because none of it meets my personal quality standards and it is pretty much no different than allowing second life images. This is why we have the tag, it's a courtesy tag for those who don't want to see often bad art.


Chaser said:
Eh, blender is like 3ds max/etc. It would be the same as tagging Photoshop for images drawn in Photoshop vwhich would be very redundant.
The reason we have sfm and daz3d tags is because these are often of low quality(high enough to meet quality standards but low enough to look bad).
Personally I feel we shouldn't allow sfm art because none of it meets my personal quality standards and it is pretty much no different than allowing second life images. This is why we have the tag, it's a courtesy tag for those who don't want to see often bad art.

Well for the posts that are tagged as SFM anyway. THere are a LOT of posts that are SFM but aren't tagged as such.