TL;DR read the text. It's important.

The_Diggler said:

Long ass text on some personal views on morality

I've come to the realization that I experienced a twisted childhood, adolescence and teenage stage in my life. There was good there, I experienced happiness but most of it was pain and self hatred that effected my physical and mental health.

Let me say, I'm better now. I really am. and I'm feeling better every day. I believe I have gone through a natural therapy with understanding, acceptance, socializing and love. I didn't have this mentality growing up and I definitely wasn't shown this from others. I'm not cured of all my problems but I at least can fix them. And now I'm not afraid to ask others for help.
I've made very bad decisions in my life. Some I would not tell another soul. Ever. But my past life experiences are no excuse for my behavior. I made the decisions I made because they made sense, most of the time, and because I wanted to. Looking back now, I don't believe I was completely sane for a good part of my life. again, not an excuse for my actions, but a reason for the way I reasoned.

and I've been struggling with the idea of being trustworthy. I think I finally understand that to be trustworthy you have to trust people. and trusting people has been so hard for me. Because I know that people have a limit to how much trust they can give. For example, say you were a murderer. You murdered people because it's what made sense to you. Maybe you had doubts about what you did and knew it was wrong. But you did it anyway because you are human and humans have different reasons for their behavior. Now say time has gone by and you realize you did wrong and you don't want to do it anymore. and you don't. That will not matter to some people. They will not trust you no matter what because they know your past behavior and they might even understand your reasoning but they can never know what you are feeling. They can't tell the future so they will naturally distrust you. This is human nature.
Like I said I've done things. My own morality wouldn't let me hurt someone and not want to tell that person that it was me who hurt them if they didn't know my involvement. but that's not the case for me. I betrayed someone. I betrayed someone who trusted me, I had my reasons (which I have learned from) but the fact still stands that I betrayed them. They don't know what I've done. I know they never will. the only person hurting from my behavior is me, they have suffered no pain, no loss. But I could hurt them by telling them what I've done. and do to my reasoning and my morality I have decided not too. Yes It's true I'm afraid that they won't forgive me, and rightfully so, people don't have to forgive you or trust you. Even if you have genuinely turned your life around for the better, they don't have to forgive you because if most people find out what you've done then they won't look at the good in you. I've had to search for the good in me, through all the self hatred, but I finally found it. I finally understand myself. I know I've done bad. But that doesn't make me bad. I know I can enjoy life and be happy. I can trust people and be trusted, I just have to be careful who I trust and how much I trust them with.

This is my current mentality. Please tell me what you think. If you think I'm wrong, if you think I'm right or if you think I'm a batshit crazy sociopath. I'm curious to see what others will have to say about being trustworthy. Is there someone in this world that you can trust with 100% of yourself, good or bad? Think hard about that before you answer me.

TL;DR read the text. It's important.

I will respond on the morrow after a good night's sleep.

Aeruginis said:
I will respond on the morrow after a good night's sleep.

As shall I.

*sigh*

To start, I'm not going claim to be the most trustworthy or accepting person in the world. Though it maybe true that I often see myself as such and by my own genuine nature hold to that as a lifestyle, I'm not going get ahead of myself here.

Now, a little known fact about me: IRL, I have intimately known thieves, liars, cheaters and yes, even murderers. But despite their "bad behaviors", coming to know them wasn't always a bad thing for either party.

The way I see it, humans are not innately evil. No matter what. Humans do bad things because they do what they have to, (survival/security) or they believe something wholeheartedly. (religion/etc.) Such is always true, for better or for worse. There is always an end goal to every bad action one make take, whether it is made completely clear or not.

As such, I always try so hard to see the good in people, no matter what. I try to accept people, even when their past actions mean no one else will. Now sometimes, this only leads me to get burned. Badly burned. In fact, that happens most times. But what kind of person would that make me if such negative interactions with bad people caused me to be unforgiving of the others like them who are good deep down? If I'm honest, I think that would make me equally a bad person as those who have burned me.

But that particular mindset is more pertaining to Acceptance, rather than Trustworthiness.

Now to be fair, this issue of trust is one that lots of people struggle with. Myself included. I actually don't trust anyone, hence why I have no one I call "friends" IRL. Sure I can have acquaintances and even people that call me their friend because of my unwavering honesty, loyalty and acceptance of others, but I don't really trust anyone myself. I have this idea in my head that no one REALLY wants to help people, hence why therapists get paid money to listen, or nurses get paid money to heal, or police officers get paid money to enforce security. In my opinion, if people really wanted to be innately good, they'd do what they do regardless of the payback/compensation. And I don't know of anyone that would still pour years of time and effort into a profession such a become a surgeon and do life-saving operations for literally zero pay other than what one may refer to as "Good/Hero Karma".

That said, I seem to be the only human on the planet that will offer whatever is needed to those who need it, even when no one does so much as says thank you back, and as such most people come to quickly trust me more than anyone else in public and in private. And with that trust graciously bestowed upon me by so many, I simply can't bring myself to let them down or betray them. Heck, I even beat myself up for days at a time when I do something simple, like accept free food from someone who offers, because deep down I feel like I'm taking advantage of people when I do such things. And that's not what I'm about morally.

(Of course even if I was a "True Hero" according to any system of accumulative Karma, I don't think it would count for much since my life was forever ruined from the day I was conceived because I was born wrong, and as such no amount of Good or Evil Karma will never allow me to have what I desire in life. But that's a story for another day, I suppose.)

But at the same time, I simply can't trust humans. I don't know why, but I can't. I can accept people for who they are or what they have done, good or bad, and if I have any doubts I can try even to read them to find the truest intents of a person if such is hidden. But despite this, for some reason I can't actually deeply TRUST anyone.

And so I say all of this to make the following humble conclusion: From what I can tell from your words above, your struggle is very likely one of Acceptance rather than Trustworthiness. But since I don't really know the whole story, it is not for me to say for sure.

But given this new insight, maybe you should reconsider whether your issue truly is one of Trustworthiness, or just one of Acceptance. And if it is one if acceptance, then keep in mind that you can't really expect someone to accept you despite your past actions if you can't even so much as accept and trust your reformed self, regardless of another person's willingness to accept the new you.

Either way, I truly wish you the best.

Kristal_Candeo said:
The way I see it, humans are not innately evil. No matter what. Humans do bad things because they do what they have to. There is always an end goal to every bad action one make take, whether it is made completely clear or not.

.....without self-dramatisation he doesn't reckon on being around to see forty. He has no plans. Maybe he'll write his life story and call it The Last Of The Hard Men. Then, he laughs at that because, shit, there's no such thing as a hard man. It's what happens to you that makes you what you are and, well, when it's put up to you you can't back away from it. There's no glory in that. It makes you do vicious things, it gets vicious things done to you. But that's just the way it is. Where's the choice?

- The Small Legend of Karl Crawley

Phylax said:
.....without self-dramatisation he doesn't reckon on being around to see forty. He has no plans. Maybe he'll write his life story and call it The Last Of The Hard Men. Then, he laughs at that because, shit, there's no such thing as a hard man. It's what happens to you that makes you what you are and, well, when it's put up to you you can't back away from it. There's no glory in that. It makes you do vicious things, it gets vicious things done to you. But that's just the way it is. Where's the choice?

- The Small Legend of Karl Crawley

That guy knows.

Kristal_Candeo said:

*sigh*

To start, I'm not going claim to be the most trustworthy or accepting person in the world. Though it maybe true that I often see myself as such and by my own genuine nature hold to that as a lifestyle, I'm not going get ahead of myself here.

Now, a little known fact about me: IRL, I have intimately known thieves, liars, cheaters and yes, even murderers. But despite their "bad behaviors", coming to know them wasn't always a bad thing for either party.

The way I see it, humans are not innately evil. No matter what. Humans do bad things because they do what they have to, (survival/security) or they believe something wholeheartedly. (religion/etc.) Such is always true, for better or for worse. There is always an end goal to every bad action one make take, whether it is made completely clear or not.

As such, I always try so hard to see the good in people, no matter what. I try to accept people, even when their past actions mean no one else will. Now sometimes, this only leads me to get burned. Badly burned. In fact, that happens most times. But what kind of person would that make me if such negative interactions with bad people caused me to be unforgiving of the others like them who are good deep down? If I'm honest, I think that would make me equally a bad person as those who have burned me.

But that particular mindset is more pertaining to Acceptance, rather than Trustworthiness.

Now to be fair, this issue of trust is one that lots of people struggle with. Myself included. I actually don't trust anyone, hence why I have no one I call "friends" IRL. Sure I can have acquaintances and even people that call me their friend because of my unwavering honesty, loyalty and acceptance of others, but I don't really trust anyone myself. I have this idea in my head that no one REALLY wants to help people, hence why therapists get paid money to listen, or nurses get paid money to heal, or police officers get paid money to enforce security. In my opinion, if people really wanted to be innately good, they'd do what they do regardless of the payback/compensation. And I don't know of anyone that would still pour years of time and effort into a profession such a become a surgeon and do life-saving operations for literally zero pay other than what one may refer to as "Good/Hero Karma".

That said, I seem to be the only human on the planet that will offer whatever is needed to those who need it, even when no one does so much as says thank you back, and as such most people come to quickly trust me more than anyone else in public and in private. And with that trust graciously bestowed upon me by so many, I simply can't bring myself to let them down or betray them. Heck, I even beat myself up for days at a time when I do something simple, like accept free food from someone who offers, because deep down I feel like I'm taking advantage of people when I do such things. And that's not what I'm about morally.

(Of course even if I was a "True Hero" according to any system of accumulative Karma, I don't think it would count for much since my life was forever ruined from the day I was conceived because I was born wrong, and as such no amount of Good or Evil Karma will never allow me to have what I desire in life. But that's a story for another day, I suppose.)

But at the same time, I simply can't trust humans. I don't know why, but I can't. I can accept people for who they are or what they have done, good or bad, and if I have any doubts I can try even to read them to find the truest intents of a person if such is hidden. But despite this, for some reason I can't actually deeply TRUST anyone.

And so I say all of this to make the following humble conclusion: From what I can tell from your words above, your struggle is very likely one of Acceptance rather than Trustworthiness. But since I don't really know the whole story, it is not for me to say for sure.

But given this new insight, maybe you should reconsider whether your issue truly is one of Trustworthiness, or just one of Acceptance. And if it is one if acceptance, then keep in mind that you can't really expect someone to accept you despite your past actions if you can't even so much as accept and trust your reformed self, regardless of another person's willingness to accept the new you.

Either way, I truly wish you the best.

Thanks Kristal. Really thank you. From what you've said, I believe I was able to explain myself pretty well. You seemed to grasp it a lot easier than I expected. I expected that people would not get it. I expected that this would fall on death ears. I was wrong. and I need to accept that. You're right. I believe my main problem is one of acceptance, trust is just a symptom of my real problem. So thanks. :)

You said you don't trust people. Not really at least, right? Kristal, I don't know if what I'm gonna say is the "right" thing to tell you. I don't know if this will keep you safe in life. But I believe not trusting 100% of people 100% of the time is a good decision. I don't think that means you don't "trust" people. Because you do...just not 100%. You accept that some people will not accept you, so you in turn can not accept most people 100% and that's ok, you're human and it's what we do to protect ourselves.

But. I believe there is that person, somewhere, that can accept my 100%. They can accept me for who I am. Even if it will expose them to danger, even if it's not the most logical solution. I believe someone like that exist for me. That doesn't mean that there is Kristal. I know that. But I would rather have hope that I'll meet someone like that.

Until said time when I'll meet that person. That perfect person for me. I'll accept that some people can only give me 10% of themselves, or 40% or 90%. It's ok. We're human. I just have to see how much people will accept me. In essence, we're just guessing at best lol. I think that's good enough. Because at the end of the day, I have accepted a lot about myself and I still am. That makes life....good for me. and it can only get better.

You can trust people kristal. You just gotta know how much.

Again Kristal. You don't know how much what you said to me means. Thank you so much :)

The_Diggler said:
Thanks Kristal. Really thank you. From what you've said, I believe I was able to explain myself pretty well. You seemed to grasp it a lot easier than I expected. I expected that people would not get it. I expected that this would fall on death ears. I was wrong. and I need to accept that. You're right. I believe my main problem is one of acceptance, trust is just a symptom of my real problem. So thanks. :)

You said you don't trust people. Not really at least, right? Kristal, I don't know if what I'm gonna say is the "right" thing to tell you. I don't know if this will keep you safe in life. But I believe not trusting 100% of people 100% of the time is a good decision. I don't think that means you don't "trust" people. Because you do...just not 100%. You accept that some people will not accept you, so you in turn can not accept most people 100% and that's ok, you're human and it's what we do to protect ourselves.

But. I believe there is that person, somewhere, that can accept my 100%. They can accept me for who I am. Even if it will expose them to danger, even if it's not the most logical solution. I believe someone like that exist for me. That doesn't mean that there is Kristal. I know that. But I would rather have hope that I'll meet someone like that.

Until said time when I'll meet that person. That perfect person for me. I'll accept that some people can only give me 10% of themselves, or 40% or 90%. It's ok. We're human. I just have to see how much people will accept me. In essence, we're just guessing at best lol. I think that's good enough. Because at the end of the day, I have accepted a lot about myself and I still am. That makes life....good for me. and it can only get better.

You can trust people kristal. You just gotta know how much.

Again Kristal. You don't know how much what you said to me means. Thank you so much :)

I'm so glad I could help. Truly.

If you ever need anymore advice in the future, or even just a pal to talk to about whatever with, you can always PM me. I'd be happy to chat whenever you wish.

Kristal_Candeo said:
I'm so glad I could help. Truly.

If you ever need anymore advice in the future, or even just a pal to talk to about whatever with, you can always PM me. I'd be happy to chat whenever you wish.

About Your Advice to Me:

And I guess you are right about my own trust issues and stuff. I find that I can trust people in a sense, like knowing they are telling the truth, etc. But I never trust anyone 100%, to the point where when they try to help me through a problem, either out of worry or friendship, I actually let them help me. And this would explain my lack of True friends. Sure I can have acquaintances that may even refer to me as a best friend, but as far as from my perspective, a best friend is someone you trust more than other people, and as such I don't see anyone as a true friend because I trust all humans ~the same amount, friend or stranger. (Unless they give me reason to doubt them via dishonest behavior towards me personally, which goes without saying I guess.) But that's only because I know humans are just that: humans.

But I suppose that's my own problem to get over, not anyone else's. Either way, thanks for the feedback on that, pal.

Good talk bro ;) I'll give you call if I need too.