Okay, so I tried to fit the relevant information into the title, but it wasn't quite possible.

Basically, let me give you a short version, if I can.

I am writing a story that is important to me, for reasons, and because of that, I want it to be good. I am determined to make it as good as I can. So I want someone who's willing to be honest with what they think about what I have so far.

I'm not looking for an editor - I have some other editors, and I've been reading through and nitpicking sections myself repeatedly... What I'm looking for is a reader. Someone to come in and simply read what I have so far - is it compelling? What do you think of the style, and pacing, and whatnot - the sorts of things you'd think about if you read a book from the bookstore.

Ideally I'd like someone who reads or has read a fair bit... And, though this is fanfiction, and erotica, I'd like to be compared to actual novels. I want to be held to a high standard. Honest, but harsh, if harshness is called for.

I am not thin-skinned, so you don't need to worry about a bad reaction to that.

The story is currently about 10 chapters long, at about 30,000 words, so it won't be a super-short read, though it's still only novella length. It is an erotic story, set in the Pokemon universe. It involves "feral" Pokemon, and a few different sorts of gender pairings. You probably ought to be comfortable with all of that.

Again, I'm looking for general thoughts rather than editing, so the actual feedback part ought to be easy enough, as long as you are a thoughtful reader.

Are you willing to wait a day or two? I'm going to bed, so I can't read it right now. I read a lot of fanfiction and erotica, and can catch a bad read within a couple of paragraphs normally. The pacing is too fast, or the characters speak too simply, or the descriptions are bare-bones, etc.

Based on the way that you comment, I imagine your work to be competent at least. I tried writing myself, once, but the pacing was difficult to grasp, and I wasn't very motivated.

MultiverseEquine said:
Are you willing to wait a day or two? I'm going to bed, so I can't read it right now. I read a lot of fanfiction and erotica, and can catch a bad read within a couple of paragraphs normally. The pacing is too fast, or the characters speak too simply, or the descriptions are bare-bones, etc.

Based on the way that you comment, I imagine your work to be competent at least. I tried writing myself, once, but the pacing was difficult to grasp, and I wasn't very motivated.

I am pretty confident that my writing is better than a lot of incompetent fanfiction, so that's not the standard I want to hold myself to. Not that I don't have my bad moments, I'm sure, but I really want to hold myself to a higher standard, at least in this one case - the sort of stuff you might see published in a bookstore, perhaps.

So, having read a lot of fanfiction and erotica is a plus, sure, but at the same time I'm also looking for someone who's read a lot of traditional literature as well. If that describes you, this could work, but if you tend to stick mostly with fanfiction and erotica - that's fine, don't get me wrong, but it's not quite what I need right now.

That said, I've got no problem waiting... heck, as long as anyone needs. Honestly I've been working on this project for probably over a year now (though very on-and-off), so I don't even mind if it takes a week or two to get around to starting it.

My one time-based restriction is I like to know when you intend to get around to it. If It's a week, that's fine. If a week comes around and you don't have time, that's also fine, but I really appreciate an update ("Oh hey, just letting you know, stuff came up, give me another week and it should be fine"). The only thing that bothers me in that regard is silence.

Ill ask ny boyfriend. Hes always looking for new stories and spends a lot of time reading so im sure hell be able to help.

Let me join that club of "give me until tomorrow", I also am burning the midnight oil and am about to go to bed. But I'll gladly read and give you the requested input.

More of a response than I expected. I appreciate it, everyone!

Anyway, I'm pretty close to going to bed as well, so no problem on that.

I read a lot of real books so I'll try reading it, I don't know when I'll actually read it though maybe tonight or maybe in a week.

Clawdragons said:
Stuff

I didn't mean to insult your writing by comparing it to fanfiction, though that seems to be what your work is, based on your description. I tend to drop the majority of the things I read due to a lack of quality within the first chapter, so the belief that I just read and enjoy whatever trash is placed in front of me is simply wrong.

The fact that the Twilight book series is a published series at all tells me that the quality necessary for publishing is not as prestigious as one might assume. Fanfiction may have a lot more trash among it, but it isn't just trash.

Other than that, I have read a book containing a lot of Lovecraft's work recently, so I suppose that might be indicative of my quality of reading?

I don't actually read a lot of physical books. I would read a lot more if I knew which ones were good, rather than hearing about mediocre books through word of mouth. Most of the ones that catch my eye, and begin reading, do not meet my standards or appeal to my interests, and I drop them. It's a lot easier to just look though fanfiction because its free, I don't need to go anywhere, and I occasionally find a work that is truly special.

If I'm still not what you are looking for, I hope you find someone to help you either way.

MultiverseEquine said:
I didn't mean to insult your writing by comparing it to fanfiction, though that seems to be what your work is, based on your description.

No! Sorry! I didn't mean it that way.

It is fanfiction, and it's not an insult to compare it to fanfiction. My point was simply that a lot of fanfiction is of particularly low quality in my experience, so I don't really want my story held to the "average fanfic" level of quality. I want it held to a higher standard than that.

I freely admit that there is fanfiction out there that is better written than this story. There is fanfiction out there that is better written than much published work. Some of it is incredibly masterfully done. But that's much more rare among fanfiction than among published work.

I tend to drop the majority of the things I read due to a lack of quality within the first chapter, so the belief that I just read and enjoy whatever trash is placed in front of me is simply wrong.

I wasn't saying that you read a bunch of trash either. Oh jeez, I feel like I accidentally insulted you, and that couldn't be further from my intent.

The fact that the Twilight book series is a published series at all tells me that the quality necessary for publishing is not as prestigious as one might assume. Fanfiction may have a lot more trash among it, but it isn't just trash.

Yeah, published work isn't always good. But it is on average of higher quality, at least.

And to be fair, for all its flaws, at least not every other word in Twilight is misspelled. Hah.

Okay hopefully that cleared things up. I certainly wasn't trying to insult you, by any means, nor was I trying to insult fanfiction as a medium.

Anyway, since you, and a few others volunteered, I'll send a couple of PMs out now. It's later in the day than I intended, but bah, it's been busy.

Protip.

I have some other editors, and I've been reading through and nitpicking sections myself repeatedly...

Don't do that.

EightyNine said:
Don't do that.

Sometimes what's called for is going with what you started with, other times things are just not written properly.

Editing is pretty important. Most things are not published as a first draft,

I'm not changing things for the sake of changing things. But if, for instance, I'm reading through and I find myself rereading a sentence a few times because I can't tell what it's trying to say, that sentence ought to be changed. If I find that I've repeated a phrase a bit too often, or I skimped on description somewhere, yeah, I'll change that.

Also GDelscribe, I was thinking about it and depending on some things, if you wanted to help yourself, there's something that you might be uniquely qualified for with respect to this story.

Start off the story with the character eating pizza. I guarantee that the readers will be locked into the story after seeing that.

I've read the story once in it's entirety, and I intend to read it again to gather my thoughts on it. I liked your story, and I will send you my more complete impressions of it over PM after my reread.

MultiverseEquine said:
I've read the story once in it's entirety, and I intend to read it again to gather my thoughts on it. I liked your story, and I will send you my more complete impressions of it over PM after my reread.

Nifty. Glad you liked what's there so far, and I look forward to your full impressions.

Thanks again for taking the time to do this. It really is helpful.

Clawdragons said:
Sometimes what's called for is going with what you started with, other times things are just not written properly

Nei nei nei nei, I mean self-editing.
Try as you might, self-editing is the worst thing you can do; a combination of being your own harshest critic and varying inspiration will render the results absolutely inconsistent.

Write it once, hand it to the editor. Work on it from there,or else you'll burn your work every time.

EightyNine said:
Nei nei nei nei, I mean self-editing.
Try as you might, self-editing is the worst thing you can do; a combination of being your own harshest critic and varying inspiration will render the results absolutely inconsistent.

Write it once, hand it to the editor. Work on it from there,or else you'll burn your work every time.

This isn't really something I want to argue about, so we're going to have to agree to disagree here.

Clawdragons said:
This isn't really something I want to argue about, so we're going to have to agree to disagree here.

He has a point that the vast majority of writers - whether they are inept or masters - are not able to self-edit their work in a way that will be successful to the eyes of their audience.

Also, it doesn't really make sense to have editors and self-edit.

But no one can force you to avoid taking this path, and as long as you know the risks I won't condemn it.

FibS said:
He has a point that the vast majority of writers - whether they are inept or masters - are not able to self-edit their work in a way that will be successful to the eyes of their audience.

Also, it doesn't really make sense to have editors and self-edit.

But no one can force you to avoid taking this path, and as long as you know the risks I won't condemn it.

Different writers have different strategies. Some writers will revise what they write countless times, some try to hold off on any sort of editing until after a full draft, and some will rely on editors heavily.

Which of these strategies works? All of them do, and none of them do. It depends on the individual, and even then it can vary.

There are risks to editing, and there are risks to not editing.

Clawdragons said:
Different writers have different strategies. Some writers will revise what they write countless times, some try to hold off on any sort of editing until after a full draft, and some will rely on editors heavily.

Which of these strategies works? All of them do, and none of them do. It depends on the individual, and even then it can vary.

There are risks to editing, and there are risks to not editing.

Many, many creators have ruined their work under the banner of "it's my style".

FibS said:
Many, many creators have ruined their work under the banner of "it's my style".

I don't disagree, but also I don't really see how that's particularly relevant here, honestly.

EightyNine said:
Nei nei nei nei, I mean self-editing.
Try as you might, self-editing is the worst thing you can do; a combination of being your own harshest critic and varying inspiration will render the results absolutely inconsistent.

Write it once, hand it to the editor. Work on it from there,or else you'll burn your work every time.

FibS said:
Many, many creators have ruined their work under the banner of "it's my style".

why are you making such a big deal about that? After reading the whole story I thought it was written just fine. By the way clawdragons I'll try to send you a PM in the next two or three days.

Doomguy666 said:
why are you making such a big deal about that? After reading the whole story I thought it was written just fine. By the way clawdragons I'll try to send you a PM in the next two or three days.

I'm looking forward to hearing your thoughts then. Glad you thought it was written well enough.

Also thanks for the comment here. I've never had a reader come to my defense before, and it was... Seriously quite gratifying. Made my day, honestly, even if it's just about a silly little civil argument like this was. Maybe that's silly, but hey, that's how it goes.

Doomguy666 said:
why are you making such a big deal about that? After reading the whole story I thought it was written just fine. By the way clawdragons I'll try to send you a PM in the next two or three days.

Welcome to the trap of 'defend first, think later.'

Let me explain it simply for you.

Doomguy666 said:
why are you making such a big deal about that?

Being an award-winning writer (true fact, back in the day, I won a state competition. Ironically with something I typed up in an hour...that I didn't get to edit. How bout that!) that's only officially released two pieces of work is a strong indicator.

The end result of self edited work is strongly leaning towards being gutted because one looks at it later, and starts removing 'unnecessary parts.' Or they'll add more without initial consideration for the rest of the story in terms of pacing, structure, focus and and attention to real detail.

Or, worst case scenario, they'll get frustrated by something and scrap whole segments of writing. Most writers who selfedit don't keep backups of that shit. Why would they? They thought it was shit.

I've scrapped, erased, deleted, and crumpled up more than most have even written. I've slashed it and burned it, whole volumes of work put to Scorched Earth because I didn't follow through; gigabytes, annihilated. Whole stacks of penned papers, never seen by the eyes of man.

Aaaaallll because I got angry at one such part, or didn't pace this or space that. Little tiny things that add up to a big mess because one person parallel-processing the fiction behind the fiction with the fact behind the fiction muddies the whole creative process.

Long story short, don't self edit. You'll never get anything done.

EightyNine, the fact that self-editing didn't work for you doesn't mean that it doesn't work for anybody.

Hemmingway did quite a bit of self-editing. I recall reading an interview by him wherein he stated he edited the final page of one of his stories thirty-nine times. If you're going the "I'm an award-winning author" route, I'm sorry, but he very probably trumps you on that.

That said, there are other famous authors who agree with you. And others who don't! That's the thing. People have different processes. Just because something works for you, or doesn't work for you, doesn't mean that's universal.

I'm trying to be polite here, but I'm actually rather annoyed. I wanted this argument to be over, and you won't let it die.

So here's the deal. I've made my stance clear: different people have different methods. You've gone with a different strategy - arguing from your own notability. So let's go with that argument. If you can convince me that your notability trumps Hemmingway's, I'll concede the argument to you.

Seems fair to me.

EightyNine said:
Welcome to the trap of 'defend first, think later.'

Let me explain it simply for you.
Being an award-winning writer (true fact, back in the day, I won a state competition. Ironically with something I typed up in an hour...that I didn't get to edit. How bout that!) that's only officially released two pieces of work is a strong indicator.

The end result of self edited work is strongly leaning towards being gutted because one looks at it later, and starts removing 'unnecessary parts.' Or they'll add more without initial consideration for the rest of the story in terms of pacing, structure, focus and and attention to real detail.

Or, worst case scenario, they'll get frustrated by something and scrap whole segments of writing. Most writers who selfedit don't keep backups of that shit. Why would they? They thought it was shit.

I've scrapped, erased, deleted, and crumpled up more than most have even written. I've slashed it and burned it, whole volumes of work put to Scorched Earth because I didn't follow through; gigabytes, annihilated. Whole stacks of penned papers, never seen by the eyes of man.

Aaaaallll because I got angry at one such part, or didn't pace this or space that. Little tiny things that add up to a big mess because one person parallel-processing the fiction behind the fiction with the fact behind the fiction muddies the whole creative process.

Long story short, don't self edit. You'll never get anything done.

Did you just accuse me of not thinking?

Not that what I said required much thought nor do I have a reason to defend clawdragons, I was stating that despite your vehement objections to self-editing the story was written just fine.
Furthermore what do you think the point of this thread was? It was so clawdragons could get feedback on if it's compelling, pacing, and style much of what you said would get ruined by self-editing.

Apparently you missed that and focused on one comment used to emphasize the fact he's not looking for anymore editors, just so you could say "protip".