I'm planning on adding the following to white sclera:

As a general rule, you don't need to tag images with white sclera unless the character typically has different-colored sclera.

Does anyone object to this being added?

Considering that a large amount of characters have white scleras, should we really tag every instance of white sclera?

I object to the tag even existing, it's going to just waste time.

Tuvalu said:
I object to the tag even existing, it's going to just waste time.

^

Edit: Adding the note to the wiki isn't a bad idea though.

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO.

NEIN!

It would be redundant at best.

white sclrea tag is already pretty commonly used tag. it has almost 3000 posts

i mean no i don't object to the wiki being updated

that's what we're talking about, rite

How is it up to 3000 posts? The last time this came up, we agreed not to use it.

Should've just invalidated it back then. :/

It seems way too common to be a useful tag. Black and Yellow sclera tagging make more sense since they are something much less common.

How about having everything else implicate to something like nonwhite_sclera, that way we don't HAVE a white sclera tag but -nonwhite_sclera can still act as an approximation if someone needs it to..

I now add white_sclera to any applicable post when I tag.

We will get it to 100k.

https://e621.net/forum/show/170303

uhhhh how about we invalidate the white sclera tag. its extremely useless since it applies to 90% of content here and then start using something like colored sclera for blacklisting and searching purposes

I'll admit to tagging white sclera when Renamon is shown with them instead of her normally black sclera.

Googlipod said:
I'll admit to tagging white sclera when Renamon is shown with them instead of her normally black sclera.

You could always link directly to the search via \{\{search parameters\}\} to show something like white_sclera renamon. While I like having white_sclera for that, it definitely needs to be cleaned off of posts like post #790705 where it's tagged simply because Rika has white sclera as a human.

This seems to need a bump, as there are a lot of entries in white_sclera that don't fit what I added.

Example: post #820937 has a character with pink sclera and Rarity, who doesn't have colored sclera by default.

Googlipod said:
This seems to need a bump, as there are a lot of entries in white_sclera that don't fit what I added.

Definitely agree with your addition of that disclaimer to the wiki, along with the rest of the majority of the thread. In fact, I would bold it for maximum attention, rewrite the article to be more explicit and redundant, and then include the reasoning too, so that the description text for the article ends up looking something like this:

Of course, no matter how thorough the wiki explanation is made, we'll never stop people from just seeing the other <colored_sclera> tags in use and then assuming white is a thing that should be added to most submissions, since the logic follows at first glance. Could be better to just invalidate white_sclera as a tag instead as I'm not sure how particularly beneficial it is to keep it just to be able to tag out cases of atypically-white-colored sclera.

Actually, that's maybe an idea: Invalidate white_sclera and add a new, more explicit tag along the lines of atypically_white_sclera or better yet white_sclera_(atypical) so it gets the point across while they type it out to help prevent mistags while also maintaining the functionality of having a white sclera tag?

I concur. Wiki entry or not, it'll keep getting tagged the same way. Because there's no reason to think that it should be tagged different from other tags in the group.

I'm for invalidating it, but how about just using the alternate_eye_color tag instead? I don't think we need anything more specific than that; the sclera tags are of marginal use at best.

Genjar said:
I concur. Wiki entry or not, it'll keep getting tagged the same way. Because there's no reason to think that it should be tagged different from other tags in the group.

Sadly, I agree.

Genjar said:
I'm for invalidating it, but how about just using the alternate_eye_color tag instead?

The alternate_eye_color tag sounds like a good idea. EDIT: actually, an alternate_sclera_color seems better. As well as invalidating the white_sclera tag.

Crispix said:
Definitely agree with your addition of that disclaimer to the wiki, along with the rest of the majority of the thread. In fact, I would bold it for maximum attention, rewrite the article to be more explicit and redundant, and then include the reasoning too, so that the description text for the article ends up looking something like this:

New proposed text for 'white_sclera' wiki entry:

Unlike the other '<color>_sclera' tags, the white_sclera tag is only to be used in images where a character with typically non-white sclera has been depicted with white sclera instead. The sclera, colloquially known as "the white of the eye", is the firm, protective casing that holds in the contents of the eyeball.

As a general rule this tag should be used sparingly as, again, you don't need to tag images with white_sclera unless the character being tagged typically has differently-colored sclera.

For example: the character "Renamon" is almost always depicted with black_sclera, but is still occasionally depicted with white.] The reasoning for not tagging "standard" cases of white_sclera is much the same as the reason ears and legs are invalid tags: All of these things are such common features on most characters depicted in art that they can be considered the 'default' or 'standard equipment', and are therefore not worth specifically tagging in most cases.

Of course, no matter how thorough the wiki explanation is made, we'll never stop people from just seeing the other <colored_sclera> tags in use and then assuming white is a thing that should be added to most submissions, since the logic follows at first glance. Could be better to just invalidate white_sclera as a tag instead as I'm not sure how particularly beneficial it is to keep it just to be able to tag out cases of atypically-white-colored sclera.

Actually, that's maybe an idea: Invalidate white_sclera and add a new, more explicit tag along the lines of atypically_white_sclera or better yet white_sclera_(atypical) so it gets the point across while they type it out to help prevent mistags while also maintaining the functionality of having a white sclera tag?

If we do add the atypical tag, we should move the images over before we invalidate white_sclera.

I agree on invalidating the tag, I don't see the point on having this tag as well as any other colored scleras.

Though it might be useful for someone to find a specific post with a character that has the specific sclera colour, but this is highly unlikely given that it may not be tagged properly all the time.

But still they have become quite a common tag.

So I'm 50/50 on invalidating all together or on mass-tagging/fixing of existing posts.

I have no plans to follow the "rule" in the wiki unless parasprite or another admin tells me to.

I see no problems with the tag as long as other colored sclera are tagged.

Lance_Armstrong said:
I have no plans to follow the "rule" in the wiki unless parasprite or another admin tells me to.

I see no problems with the tag as long as other colored sclera are tagged.

parasprite said:
Adding the note to the wiki isn't a bad idea though.

Stop breaking the rules that the admins are supporting, Lance :P

I was thinking that this would be good (I am a Lopunny fan, after all) but in an ideal tagging situation there shouldn't be too much difference between lopunny white_sclera and lopunny -black_sclera. Similar goes for other characters and species with non-white sclerae. So I guess the tag is unneeded, especially due to the potential overtagging.

I think the above idea proposed where we have an umbrella tag for odd sclera colours would be a good idea, but there will still be a problem with the syntax. Would it be referring to any non-white sclerae, or shades atypical for the species? Perhaps a non-white_sclera tag would be the best move, but I'm not sure.

Kaeetayel said:
I was thinking that this would be good (I am a Lopunny fan, after all) but in an ideal tagging situation there shouldn't be too much difference between lopunny white_sclera and lopunny -black_sclera. Similar goes for other characters and species with non-white sclerae. So I guess the tag is unneeded, especially due to the potential overtagging.

I think the above idea proposed where we have an umbrella tag for odd sclera colours would be a good idea, but there will still be a problem with the syntax. Would it be referring to any non-white sclerae, or shades atypical for the species? Perhaps a non-white_sclera tag would be the best move, but I'm not sure.

So, we should have an alternate_color_sclera tag? :V

Lance_Armstrong said:
I have no plans to follow the "rule" in the wiki unless parasprite or another admin tells me to.

I see no problems with the tag as long as other colored sclera are tagged.

I only mentioned it as a temporary way to discourage spending too much effort on tagging it while the tag's future is in question.

If we keep the tag, the note should probably go.

Added to forum #187706 - Advanced Policy Discussions: Implicative/Non-Conjunctive tag usage (Mar. 2016)