I would like to petition the admins of e621 to lift their ban on the posting of images containing the gem aliens from the tv show Steven Universe. They are aliens, not pure humans. All of them have (as far as i have seen) a gemstone somewhere on their body that quite clearly separates them from a normal human being. If anyone else agrees with me, please say so down below.

For reference: https://e621.net/forum/show/211864

I love Steven Universe as a show.

I disagree (for most of the gems).

I agree.

Steven Universe is a good show, and I mistakenly approved some of the images before being corrected by our leader.

I linked this decision in the deletion reason, made a while ago: https://e621.net/forum/show/211864

The decision to shatter gems has already been made. We are fully aware of "what they really are", but they look mostly like multicolored humans so we are treating them like humans.

The moment you start sourcing your posts properly, 'bra.

Lance_Armstrong said:
Steven Universe is a good show, and I mistakenly approved some of the images before being corrected by our leader.

I linked this decision in the deletion reason, made a while ago: https://e621.net/forum/show/211864

The decision to shatter gems has already been made. We are fully aware of "what they really are", but they look mostly like multicolored humans so we are treating them like humans.

I'm sorry to sound like a social justice warrior, but that seriously sounds racist, even if it's a fictional race. <_<

And still, these are aliens, and the rules also said that aliens were allowed. You're going against your own rules.

HypnoBitch said:
And still, these are aliens, and the rules also said that aliens were allowed. You're going against your own rules.

They are allowed provided they don't just look like candy-colored humans, yes.

Next thing you know, elves will be banned, then Orcs. Then everything without fur gets banned.

HypnoBitch said:
I'm sorry to sound like a social justice warrior, but that seriously sounds racist, even if it's a fictional race. <_<

And still, these are aliens, and the rules also said that aliens were allowed. You're going against your own rules.

They are pretty much indistinguishable from weird looking humans to someone who hasn't seen the show. Compare to actual alien looking aliens.

I just work for the bossman and the bossman said no so we gotta shatter all those gems. Shatter them right in the gem.

Ratte said:
They are allowed provided they don't just look like candy-colored humans, yes.

They have gems embedded into their bodies. The gems are literally part of them.

HypnoBitch said:
Next thing you know, elves will be banned, then Orcs. Then everything without fur gets banned.

Elves and orcs are explicitly allowed by the uploading guidelines: https://e621.net/wiki/show/uploading_guidelines

Lance_Armstrong said:
Elves and orcs are explicitly allowed by the uploading guidelines: https://e621.net/wiki/show/uploading_guidelines

Other than the ears of elves, they look completely human.

HypnoBitch said:
And still, these are aliens, and the rules also said that aliens were allowed.

Superman is an alien, but would you post images of him on a furry site?

BlueDingo said:
Superman is an alien, but would you post images of him on a furry site?

These aliens have different colored skin(blue, green) and gems embedded into their bodies.

And gems look like regular humans with outdated hair styles and body paint.

Since we don't want Equestria Girls humans we also don't want Steven Universe's brightly colored humans.

BlueDingo said:
Superman is an alien, but would you post images of him on a furry site?

Kal-El

NotMeNotYou said:
And gems look like regular humans with outdated hair styles and body paint.

Since we don't want Equestria Girls humans we also don't want Steven Universe's brightly colored humans.

You seem to be forgetting the fact that they have a FUCKING GEMSTONE STICKING OUT OF THEIR SKIN.

As for my opinion, against. This site is for furry content, and while I always bite my damn tongue on things that cross me, this is pretty much an open invitation for my opinion.

Just because they are aliens doesn't mean they don't fit the human statement in Notme's forum post. And saying "just blacklist it" is not a valid argument: you can easily go to another site for SU stuff, so we both have alternatives for (not) seeing these.

As Ratte said, candy colored humans, however I will elaborate my statement: they look like colored humans with unique clothings and with a small change to their bodies. Even the fact that they are aliens can be TWYK to people who deal with altered humanoids (not arguing elves and orcs, more along the lines of OC humans with altered palettes and minor details).

Ultimately, I see this as "they look like enough of a human to be a human, and changing the color of one's skin does not count as changing their status as a human lookalike", which further extends to people who watch Steven Universe correcting the tags and possibly adding erroneous ones because they know the lore, and ignore TYWS.

Let's get rid of all the elves and the Orcs and even the nekos. :/ I'm fine if they were completely human and banned, but they aren't even human at all.

NotMeNotYou said:
And gems look like regular humans with outdated hair styles and body paint.

Since we don't want Equestria Girls humans we also don't want Steven Universe's brightly colored humans.

The Equestria Girls humans are just that, human, even if their skin is oddly colored. The Gems are confirmed aliens.

HypnoBitch said:
You seem to be forgetting the fact that they have a FUCKING GEMSTONE STICKING OUT OF THEIR SKIN.

I can go get that surgery right now. Hey, it might cost me 10 grand, but it would make a statement. I don't even need a real gigantic Pearl, Amethyst, Quartz, etc. Just a colored piece of plastic.

Let's do this.

HypnoBitch said:
You seem to be forgetting the fact that they have a FUCKING GEMSTONE STICKING OUT OF THEIR SKIN.

And?

Lance_Armstrong said:
I can go get that surgery right now. Hey, it might cost me 10 grand, but it would make a statement. I don't even need a real gigantic Pearl, Amethyst, Quartz, etc. Just a colored piece of plastic.

Let's do this.

Then I can do the same damn thing with my ears and make myself look like an elf! Your logic sucks.

HypnoBitch said:
Then I can do the same damn thing with my ears and make myself look like an elf! Your logic sucks.

If every character on the site is actually a surgically altered human, I'm going to have to delete a few more posts.

Elves keep being brought up here, and I say: Yes. We ought to ban elves too. Elves look more human than candy-colored humans. To me, different colored skin is a bigger difference than slightly pointy ears.

I don't understand how that's not seen as a glaring contradiction. You literally could look like an elf in real life with a minor surgery or something - no different from filed teeth or something along those lines, and I hope and pray that "sharp teeth" isn't next on the list of things that inexplicably makes something suddenly "nonhuman enough".

HypnoBitch said:
Then I can do the same damn thing with my ears and make myself look like an elf! Your logic sucks.

And I can have a bear rug cut to shape and grafted onto my freshly flayed body to make me look like a furry.

HypnoBitch said:
You seem to be forgetting the fact that they have a FUCKING GEMSTONE STICKING OUT OF THEIR SKIN.

Yes, the gem that looks like that dot Hindu have on their foreheads. It's a zit for all intents and purposes in art.

Lance_Armstrong said:
If every character on the site is actually a surgically altered human, I'm going to have to delete a few more posts.

It's just humans in expensive fursuits, nothing more.

Lance_Armstrong said:
If every character on the site is actually a surgically altered human, I'm going to have to delete a few more posts.

Then do it. Let's ban everything. :/ Because if the crystal gems go, then by that logic, the elves, the nekos and the other human looking creatures should go.

Clawdragons said:
Elves keep being brought up here, and I say: Yes. We ought to ban elves too. Elves look more human than candy-colored humans. To me, different colored skin is a bigger difference than slightly pointy ears.

I don't understand how that's not seen as a glaring contradiction. You literally could look like an elf in real life with a minor surgery or something - no different from filed teeth or something along those lines, and I hope and pray that "sharp teeth" isn't next on the list of things that inexplicably makes something suddenly "nonhuman enough".

Not to mention if the ears are covered up by their hair, you wouldn't be able to tell them apart from a human at all.

You need to rethink your rules, NotMeNotYou. They're flawed. They're one step closer to becoming obsolete. Don't take this as an insult. Take it as advice. We need to all look at these rules some more. Although I have a feeling I'll either get banned or a bad record. Oh well. You win some, you lose some.

We should ban halflings and gnomes, at least. They're just short stout humans. Some have hairy feet, but that hardly makes them relevant.

They're still our rules. If you don't like them, this isn't the site for you.

They will not be allowed if they simply look like colorful humans. Lore is irrelevant. Having a gem on the body is not enough to count them as something other than colorful human. They otherwise have no accepted nonhuman traits (animal ears/kemonomimi, horns, wings, etc) and are thus not considered acceptable to post.

The likelihood of this changing is extremely slim.

I would not be opposed to banning elves and such given how slight the differences are between them and humans.

In all seriousness, the only species I would ban would be dwarves since depending on the source, they are either short humans or a separate race made to look like short humans. At least elves have the long pointy ears. It's not much but at least they have a non-human feature whereas dwarves generally don't. I wouldn't be against elves and equivalent going, though.

No system can be perfect, and there are plenty of edge cases. In this example, we have something not even remotely furry looking that has fallen off the edge case and into the crevasse of human-only and irrelevant to the site. So let's not pretend that the rules are obsolete. This is far from furry content. Some things have to be sacrificed, even in the gray area.

If you have Lion fucking somebody or Amethyst transformed into a chicken, we can approve that.

Anything on here could be makeup and special effects if we use that argument on it. Elves, Orcs, even Furries could be humans in very advanced makeup or costume. By this logic, everything on the website could be banned. TWYS is the only thing preventing anyone from tagging a furry as a human in a furry suit. Seriously. Think about this shit. It's deep.

Well, I'm done with this shit. I'm tired. I'm heading to bed, and I'm probably just going to lurk around this particular topic, not posting anything, but laughing at everyone's arguments because I'm very insecure about myself. Had an awesome time debating with y'all. Nite.

HypnoBitch said:
TWYS is the only thing preventing anyone from tagging a furry as a human in a furry suit. Seriously. Think about this shit. It's deep.

I am a polar bear in a human suit so please stop calling me a human. I may look like a human but I'm a polar bear in disguise, honest.

-1. No colorful humans! No Equestria girls and no Steven Universe gems.

I also support a ban on elves, which are just humans with an insignificant anatomical change.

HypnoBitch said:
Anything on here could be makeup and special effects if we use that argument on it. Elves, Orcs, even Furries could be humans in very advanced makeup or costume. By this logic, everything on the website could be banned. TWYS is the only thing preventing anyone from tagging a furry as a human in a furry suit. Seriously. Think about this shit. It's deep.

Your own logic so far in the thread here has been sorta flawed here and there in my opinion.

For the record though, I do largely agree with you in that I think it's a bit contradictory for Elves and similar humanoid races to be allowed here by themselves when there are rules against the posting of humans - I feel that they're basically the same thing and we should ban them all - that content is available on plenty of other booru sites around the internet in mass quantities, hundreds of times over and over again, and I don't think it needs to be here as well when other sites are larger and more populated repositories of that content already. I think e621 has benefited, and continues to benefit as a website from having a tighter focus on furry-content and serving that specific audience....and would benefit even more from officially tightening that focus the rest of the way.

That said... You keep bringing up Nekos specifically: Nekos and other animal_humanoids are fine and don't really violate the spirit of what those rules are trying to do much at all, because again, this is primarily a furry site and things like animal ears are *furry traits*. This is a big distinction between elf ears on a human, a gem embedded in a human, or a purple colored human: A human with animal ears is actually on the furry spectrum and is on it's way to being furry...unlike an Elf or a Gem. Therefore it fits in with the spirit of the site and the spirit of those rules.

In my opinion, I think everything would be much clearer if we'd stop conflating what is actually two separate distinct points of contention that usually come up with this topic: "Non-human" content.... and "Furry-relevant" content; because they aren't the same thing even if they do have an overlap between them. For example: A furry character or a feral fox is "Non-human", sure....but they're Furry-relevant basically by definition. Meanwhile, a Gem, an Elf, etc...they're also "Non-human"....but they're not furry-relevant whatsoever.

Many of e621's rules and guidelines seem to be set up to imply that we only want Furry-relevant content here on this site, but then other rules don't actually support that assertion and instead make a point of only specifically trying to filter and disallow "pure-human" content.

This causes a couple important issues: The most obvious being that it instantly creates that stated contradiction of apparently implying we only want Furry-Relevant content here while then specifically enabling swathes of Non-Furry-Relevant content to be posted (like non-animalistic robots, mechanicals, animate_inanimates, monsters, humanoid races, and etc); and the second issue being that by trying to filter *only* by disallowing "pure human" content, it ends up technically directly allowing Elves, Orcs, and other races which can often visibly be 99.9% of the way to being "pure human" anyway and causes confusion(Like this whole thread) when special rules then have to be enacted to try to prop up the effectiveness of the original rule by banning only *certain* additional types of "human-but-just-barely-not-quite-human" races like the Gems and Equestria Girls ...but not others that are similarly human-like or even MORE human-like than the supplementarily-banned races.

In my opinion, instead of just trying to ban "pure humans", things would be much clearer and healthier around here if we just straight up banned all humanoid races that were not furry-relevant - or in other words, ban all humanoid races that don't contain any visibly significant animal traits that would put them on the furry spectrum.

...That or just officially remove all references and guidelines stating that people should be trying to upload "Furry relevant" art, give up on e621 being a "Furry" art repository, and instead change it into a "Non-Human" art repository... which I think would be really kinda tragic, but would make more sense with the current rules setup.

if things that look literally just oddly colored humans are not allowed, why this was approved?

post #1068847

is the one slightly more pointed fang enough to make it relevant or..?

Crispix. I only skimmed what you said. Keep this in mind, because I'm getting ready for college. Neko ears could easily be fake head accessories with the band covered by their hair. It's all how you look at it. Also, if you're going to point out flawed logic, tell me what's flawed about it so I can at least improve it.

Mutisija said:
if things that look literally just oddly colored humans are not allowed, why this was approved?

post #1068847

is the one slightly more pointed fang enough to make it relevant or..?

That seems to be an alternate angle for these characters: post #971844

I'll admit they both look human in that image, but there is an indication of fur on the fox male:

https://e621.net/wiki/show/gloves_(marking)

Finding more edge cases is not going to reveal the hypocrisy and cause us to allow gemposting. You can find thousands of more edge cases and there will always be more edge cases.

Please note that the moderation team ultimately has the last word on this and that those guidelines do not encompass every possible upload.

-1

No MLP:EG, no Steven Universe.

If e6 is to remain furry-themed, I am good with the non-human (alien aliens, machine, anthro, animal, and animal-humanoid) rules.

Like many others, I agree with clarifying and likely tightening the mostly-human rules, such as human cyborgs, undead humans (vampires and zombies), and near-human beings like elves, dwarves, et. al.

Sharp_Coyote said:
-1

No MLP:EG, no Steven Universe.

If e6 is to remain furry-themed, I am good with the non-human (alien aliens, machine, anthro, animal, and animal-humanoid) rules.

Like many others, I agree with clarifying and likely tightening the mostly-human rules, such as human cyborgs, undead humans (vampires and zombies), and near-human beings like elves, dwarves, et. al.

agreed

lol

e6 is a growing site. We're averaging almost 1k new uploads a day - it's time to start trimming the fat.

to quote myself

"We have enough trouble sorting furry content alone. We're sorry. Other boorus can and should adopt our tagging methods. We're not about to do their work for them.

I personally believe we should be even more strict and also exclude humanoids."

Anyways the gems really are just bedazzled dye-vat accident humans. They should not have gotten by on canonical technicality, ever. "Aliens" pfft

Knotty_Curls said:
e6 is a growing site. We're averaging almost 1k new uploads a day - it's time to start trimming the fat.

to quote myself

"We have enough trouble sorting furry content alone. We're sorry. Other boorus can and should adopt our tagging methods. We're not about to do their work for them.

I personally believe we should be even more strict and also exclude humanoids."

Anyways the gems really are just bedazzled dye-vat accident humans. They should not have gotten by on canonical technicality, ever. "Aliens" pfft

Don't act high and mighty.

HypnoBitch said:
Don't act high and mighty.

I am a peacock.

HypnoBitch said:
Don't act high and mighty.

And how is that acting high and mighty? They are referencing themselves, pointing out a problem that I have noticed too, they know the problems of the bulk of uploads vs the staff and are expressing it, boorus can be lenient on what they accept and that is also a curse as much as it can be a blessing, people, and I do include myself, are expressing their distaste in certain non-furry humanoids, and they are stating a loose observation one may see such characters had they not seen the show (flavor text aside)...

Try saying that five times fast.

You, on the other hand, have been aggroed to hell on this thread. Have an explanation for that?

Siral_Exan said:
And how is that acting high and mighty? They are referencing themselves, pointing out a problem that I have noticed too, they know the problems of the bulk of uploads vs the staff and are expressing it, boorus can be lenient on what they accept and that is also a curse as much as it can be a blessing, people, and I do include myself, are expressing their distaste in certain non-furry humanoids, and they are stating a loose observation one may see such characters had they not seen the show (flavor text aside)...

Try saying that five times fast.

You, on the other hand, have been aggroed to hell on this thread. Have an explanation for that?

I don't have to explain anything to you. I have a right to put in my argument, and I have. And I'm done. I have nothing against anyone. Let's just leave the elves and everything else alone for now. I only brought them in as examples to try to bring back a favorite species to the site. That's all.

Everything, even if it looks human, deserves a chance. Especially elves and crystal gems. Because when you ban one thing, something similar gets banned. I'm just trying to slow it down.

Ok but humans are still disallowed and this includes colorful humans.

That isn't going to change anytime soon.

Ratte said:
Ok but humans are still disallowed and this includes colorful humans.

That isn't going to change anytime soon.

Sorry. I'm just very passionate.

HypnoBitch said:
Sorry. I'm just very passionate.

I don't get why though.

There are plenty of other sites that specialize on human and humanoid art. Why does this one need to?

Clawdragons said:
I don't get why though.

My money's on him being an SU fanboy.

Clawdragons said:
There are plenty of other sites that specialize on human and humanoid art. Why does this one need to?

The problem there is a lot of those are either japanese only, porn only or dead.

BlueDingo said:
My money's on him being an SU fanboy.

I like SU. But that doesn't mean it belongs here.

HypnoBitch said:
Don't act high and mighty.

Knotty_Curls said:
I am a peacock.

Peacocks are, by their very natures, majestic and rarified fowl; by definition high and mighty.

Of course, there are some who attain this distinction
by reversing the appellation to mighty high ...

How I see it, barring skin color, the atanomlogical offshoots between elves and gems is that one's organic, and one's inanimate jewelry
Also, are half elves allowed?

mrnotsosafeforwork said:
Also, are half elves allowed?

Under the current rules, that depends entirely on how they look. Pointy ears? Elf. Round ears? Human. Half-elves aren't taggable by twys.

Genjar said:
Under the current rules, that depends entirely on how they look. Pointy ears? Elf. Round ears? Human. Half-elves aren't taggable by twys.

One pointy ear, one round ear?

Clawdragons said:
One pointy ear, one round ear?

Okay, almost always untaggable.

As the guy who initially pushed for a ban on Gems: The look like pastel humans with gems in them. Gems that half the time you can't even see.

Humans can have gems “in” them too. Exaggerating the size does not change it from being a common human feature.