FatherOfGray said:
I think what you are going to find out rather quickly after implementing this new rule is that less art, especially from new artists will be posted because most other than a select few dedicated and/or privileged users will even bother to ask permission first. So either this site will become less active or the content coming in will all feel samey because it's all work from the same artists.

People will ignore it and upload anyway. Mods won't bother enforcing it because of fear of backlash and the only thing that would not change is that if things you post get removed it will automatically be deducted from your ability to post. I don't see why this will change at all.

123easy said:
Potential annoyance I can see, but it's a one-off message for the first time arts is posted; I think that more artists would be appreciative of it when art is first posted under their name (Just in case you're thinking I meant EVERY time an image is posted, because just no). Having people say when they ask permission that there's going to be a notification sent to their email isn't anything worse than lords knows how many other sites that do that for verification anyways. I don't see how informing the artist that someone did indeed post their art and confirming that they got permission first is equal to nazism, or even the NRA example above.

Totally forgot I wanted to respond to that.

The thing I dislike about this is that feels like trying to indiscriminately find dirt on people.
This isn't "Innocent until proven guilty" but the other way around, we'd be actively treating people like they are wrong until we get the okay that they didn't do something wrong.

Which is where the analogy with NSA (keeping information on hand and combing through it in the hopes to find something, whether or not there is reason to believe they did something wrong in the first place) and the Nazi-Regime (Got the wrong hair color or the wrong nose form? Better hope your family tree is well documented and doesn't show any sort of jewish name on it), as both treat everyone, or a specific demographic, like criminals until proven otherwise.

Aurali said:
People will ignore it and upload anyway. Mods won't bother enforcing it because of fear of backlash and the only thing that would not change is that if things you post get removed it will automatically be deducted from your ability to post. I don't see why this will change at all.

Please stay constructive, we enforce our rules, whether you see it or not.

NotMeNotYou said:
Totally forgot I wanted to respond to that.

The thing I dislike about this is that feels like trying to indiscriminately find dirt on people.
This isn't "Innocent until proven guilty" but the other way around, we'd be actively treating people like they are wrong until we get the okay that they didn't do something wrong.

Which is where the analogy with NSA (keeping information on hand and combing through it in the hopes to find something, whether or not there is reason to believe they did something wrong in the first place) and the Nazi-Regime (Got the wrong hair color or the wrong nose form? Better hope your family tree is well documented and doesn't show any sort of jewish name on it), as both treat everyone, or a specific demographic, like criminals until proven otherwise.

Okay, I see how you can make that connection- I honestly wasn't considering that at all, since when I'd written that I'd thought of it in a "Oh, this is a new artist. Do you want to send of an automated message?" mindset, though re-reading it now with your context in mind it does seem rather (heh) draconian. Really the intent was not to be NSAing it over their shoulder, but to add another layer of covering-our-asses-working-to-help-artists-a-bit by ensuring that artists were in the loop- I've seen quite a few artists popping up on here over the years complaining about their artwork going up without them even knowing about it and only finding out a long time later when a friend clued them in. That's the sort of thing I was trying to address. ._.

NotMeNotYou said:

Please stay constructive, we enforce our rules, whether you see it or not.

This is constructive, what I'm saying is that we already experimented with it once and that was the result, what are you going to do differently? Is the take down adviser gonna inform someone that X isn't obeying the rules? How would you know someone got caught.

You guys are pretending the rule never existed before, I'm just trying to keep things grounded.

What about a list of criteria? Or possibly a contact page that the artist can be reached by? Something that the public can edit and update the artist information as we come across it? It would be an extra step, when uploading, to make sure that the artist has been contacted through the appropriate channels, but possibly a good one?

EDFDarkAngel1 said:
What about a list of criteria? Or possibly a contact page that the artist can be reached by? Something that the public can edit and update the artist information as we come across it? It would be an extra step, when uploading, to make sure that the artist has been contacted through the appropriate channels, but possibly a good one?

I like this idea and think we can expand upon it to possibly just have a field on the artist page that says "permission granted, yes or no?" and while I know anyone can just lie and say they did, it would more often then not prevent spamming the artist and be a valuable resource for uploading

I see one problem - how you would know, that accusation is true, or one who contact you is actually artist?

Mm, automated request.. hard to implement.. miost likely if that's a NEW artist - you would need search their contacts and do it manually..

I was dealing before with trolls who imposter original creators in Second Life, imposter people or artists on FA.. just for sake to create such drama. Reported by 3rd party person - even worse in such case.. it's not even legally legit - DMCA or IP request are supported only if made by original creator.

As far as determining if it is actually the artist, we already have a system in place to do just that. It helps us weed out the spammers, but most of the time, it doesn't happen all that often.

Automated request may seem a bit spammy, but at least it would be a request. Who knows? Maybe if someone gets a bunch of requests, they will be more inclined to join the site (assuming they are not already on it).

So, let's look at what we've discussed. There appears to be a large following that says something should be done, but we disagree on how. Some people who just don't want to change (change is good!), which is fine.

Artists could have a profile on here that says what they are okay with people uploading.

EDFDarkAngel1 said:
As far as determining if it is actually the artist, we already have a system in place to do just that. It helps us weed out the spammers, but most of the time, it doesn't happen all that often.

Automated request may seem a bit spammy, but at least it would be a request. Who knows? Maybe if someone gets a bunch of requests, they will be more inclined to join the site (assuming they are not already on it).

So, let's look at what we've discussed. There appears to be a large following that says something should be done, but we disagree on how. Some people who just don't want to change (change is good!), which is fine.

Artists could have a profile on here that says what they are okay with people uploading.

The automated notice I was putting forward as an idea was not to be spammy, but just a once-off, first-time-art-is-posted thing to just inform them that we are using their work, sorta like those verification emails.