Red is as fiery as her hair. No way she would want to deal with another like herself!

yuritaded said:
oh no! some one that doesnt agree with my far-left stalinist views oh the hummanity what ever will we do when people disagree with me!!!!!!!!!!

she's wearing a "don't tread on me" shirt please shut up

I'm with Red on this one. If you're gonna make assumptions, stay with the question. The statement part is unnecessary and potentially rude.

Not everyone likes opinions on their looks unless they actually ask for them.

well someone did "the steppy" xD

lurkmore said:
I know Jay is a staunch Republican, but it's almost distracting how much of a mouthpiece Red is at times. Does she not own any clothing that isn't in some way inflammatory?

Welcome to " I cry about what I am myself"

Red is VERY much into guns, the gadson flag is found among those who like and use guns A LOT.

They did rudely "tread on her" too making assumptions merely based on looks and she fired back (pun intended)

Canonically the shirt makes sense

I never really understood what was the whole drama behind people and hating Jay Naylor...

The art is good, it doesn't have extremely excessive fetishes like some others I've seen, and even the comics aren't all that bad in terms of story!

So, why did this comment section derail this fast? And where can I go to eat more popcorn learn more about this?

based

Red: woman are insane
Also red: *Friendly fire*

solenoid4lyf said:
I never really understood what was the whole drama behind people and hating Jay Naylor...

The art is good, it doesn't have extremely excessive fetishes like some others I've seen, and even the comics aren't all that bad in terms of story!

So, why did this comment section derail this fast? And where can I go to eat more popcorn learn more about this?

Speaking as an outsider, from what I've seen in the past 10+ years is that many people who like his art, are annoyed by the political ideas pushed through the art and that's what grinds the gears of many people. Guess its sorta like how someone can make a good game, tv show or movie, but every character and narrative choice gets bogged down by "the message" the creator want to be at the forefront.

That's just what I've taken notice of over the hundreds of conversations about the guy from those who just follow his work to even those who've had personal conversations with the guy. You get those who are annoyed with the political opinions he expresses through most of is work and others who are fine with it, but are annoyed with other people who voice their opinions against it.

Just answering the question. I personally don't care.

biasedthoughts said:
Speaking as an outsider, from what I've seen in the past 10+ years is that many people who like his art, are annoyed by the political ideas pushed through the art and that's what grinds the gears of many people. Guess its sorta like how someone can make a good game, tv show or movie, but every character and narrative choice gets bogged down by "the message" the creator want to be at the forefront.

That's just what I've taken notice of over the hundreds of conversations about the guy from those who just follow his work to even those who've had personal conversations with the guy. You get those who are annoyed with the political opinions he expresses through most of is work and others who are fine with it, but are annoyed with other people who voice their opinions against it.

Just answering the question. I personally don't care.

People also get annoyed by his massive ego. He acts like his opinions on fetishism or relationship drama are deep insights but they're really just bog-standard opinions on topics that are already well-worn ground. It's painfully obvious that porn addictions can cause people to seek out weird material and can make them less interested in connecting with others on an emotional level but apparently Jay needs 15 pages of intense monologues to get that point across.

biasedthoughts said:
Speaking as an outsider, from what I've seen in the past 10+ years is that many people who like his art, are annoyed by the political ideas pushed through the art and that's what grinds the gears of many people. Guess its sorta like how someone can make a good game, tv show or movie, but every character and narrative choice gets bogged down by "the message" the creator want to be at the forefront.

That's just what I've taken notice of over the hundreds of conversations about the guy from those who just follow his work to even those who've had personal conversations with the guy. You get those who are annoyed with the political opinions he expresses through most of is work and others who are fine with it, but are annoyed with other people who voice their opinions against it.

Just answering the question. I personally don't care.

Politicial messages being pushed through via his work? You mean just like what's been happening in every media format in North America and some parts of Europe since about 2013/14?

Yeah, that checks out.

I remember the first comic where the guy thought she was lesbian.

Speaking of which I would like to see her again with him.

dirtyratmatt said:
Politicial messages being pushed through via his work? You mean just like what's been happening in every media format in North America and some parts of Europe since about 2013/14?

Yeah, that checks out.

Political messaging and subliminal propaganda across every public and widely available news, entertainment, and culture outlet?

> I sleep

Political messaging and subliminal propaganda in my furry porn?

> REAL SHIT

dirtyratmatt said:
Politicial messages being pushed through via his work? You mean just like what's been happening in every media format in North America and some parts of Europe since about 2013/14?

Yeah, that checks out.

Why 2013?

I'd argue that any artist have a slight political opinion oozing in art but some of them are doing it in a smarter way.

Like how MGS is antiwar without being accusative nor complaining sounding.

I am not really fan of how JN sees women in general, when you listen to him they're all attracted sexually to big men or men that shows power in any way.

Out of context he could be seen as someone who reduces guys and gals to sex objects.

If only we could have him showing a happy monogamous couple or even some gay stuff that aren't just one or two pages long I'd be fine with it.

ginkei said:
Why 2013?

I'd argue that any artist have a slight political opinion oozing in art but some of them are doing it in a smarter way.

Like how MGS is antiwar without being accusative nor complaining sounding.

I am not really fan of how JN sees women in general, when you listen to him they're all attracted sexually to big men or men that shows power in any way.

Out of context he could be seen as someone who reduces guys and gals to sex objects.

If only we could have him showing a happy monogamous couple or even some gay stuff that aren't just one or two pages long I'd be fine with it.

THIS

Or how Fallout NV is pick your poison, none of theese are perfect and likely all will fail: Now YOU pick what you think is the least "evil" of them. They never go THIS IS THE GOOD AND THIS IS THE EVIL ...Looking at you Fallout 4. (If you are the director of the institute you could open up to the surface and make inventions for the good of the world and people in it, instead of playing god all the time)

yuritaded said:
oh no! some one that doesnt agree with my far-left stalinist views oh the hummanity what ever will we do when people disagree with me!!!!!!!!!!

WaH, PeOpLe DoN't LiKe BeInG aRoUnD mE bEcAuSe I sTaRt CrYiNg WhEn ReStAuRaNtS gIvE mE pApEr StRaWs. ThIS MuSt Be ThE CuRrEnT lEaDeR oF tHe UsSr AnD mOsT PrOgReSsIvE aMeRiCaN pReSiDeNt In HiStOrY, JoE BiDeN's DiReCt InVoLvEmEnt BeCaUsE i Am ThE pRoTaGoNiSt!

Heck yeah Red, preach that truth! I agree with you on that!

solenoid4lyf said:
I never really understood what was the whole drama behind people and hating Jay Naylor...

The art is good, it doesn't have extremely excessive fetishes like some others I've seen, and even the comics aren't all that bad in terms of story!

So, why did this comment section derail this fast? And where can I go to eat more popcorn learn more about this?

There was a lot of weird shit in his webcomics, some of which I've forgotten.

I remember too many scenes with the generic ""Leftist"" teacher stereotype that conservatives love to pretend exist, who ONLY let their students write essays on why whale hunting is bad and aren't True Patriots.

A rapist is murdered in his hospital bed by buddies of the woman he raped and this is treated as an unambiguous good thing.

The main character fucks his sister and that's treated as the one thing that happens during his childhood that doesn't need to be brought up to his therapist. There are no potentially harmful psychological consequence from two underage kids having incest sex, I guess?

The artist, using the main character as his artistsona (that character is shown drawing the comic, at a time when Jay Naylor went by that character's name), draws his mom super hot and sexy and gets peeved when someone points out it's kinda weird for him to be lusting after his mom.

The main character grows up to be a badass extrajudicial super killing machine. Someone close to him (a cousin?) goes to Hollywood, which (naturally) (because it's a hive of Leftists) turns into her being abducted into the porn industry and controlled through drug addictions. The main character rescues her from a heavily-guarded compounded using guns and grenades and being a Total Patriotic Badass. It's cringe.

There's also a thing where a little girl appears in her own fantasies as a busty sexy scientist, which is fucking weird? Naylor defended it as "that's how she'd appear to herself in her OWN fantasies, it's not ME sexualizing a child!!", as if all 5-year-old girls love to imagine themselves with huge tits bursting out of their low-cut lab coats.

There's a kind of misogyny running through his work, too, where every woman is either a super badass independent woman, a degenerate amoral slut who will suck Satan's cock in Hell, or a hippy-dippy Leftist who preaches Love and Morality while ignoring how awful they are to everyone around them. All Leftists hate AMERICA and want to destroy capitalism, all capital-A Artists are lazy, welfare-scumming hacks, etc.

It's pretty standard Ayn Rand + Red-Blooded American Patriot Conservative Who Loves His Guns, Steaks and Asses Hoo-Rah stuff, with some weird incest stuff sprinkled on top. I don't hate the guy but I see why he makes people roll their eyes really hard.

i agree with her :D

furtn said:
she's wearing a "don't tread on me" shirt please shut up

its sarcasm

Why not just let people enjoy nice art?

fountainpen00 said:
The main character fucks his sister and that's treated as the one thing that happens during his childhood that doesn't need to be brought up to his therapist. There are no potentially harmful psychological consequence from two underage kids having incest sex, I guess?

Don't forget that the main character (who is basically a self-insert) loses his virginity to his 11-year-old classmate at the age of 10.

sonicfan442 said:
Don't forget that the main character (who is basically a self-insert) loses his virginity to one of his classmates at the age of 10 to an 11-year-old classmate.

Or that said classmate is a Hyena, which are the black people of Jay's little universe. Said classmate was sexually assaulted by her Islamic Terrorist father who is gunned down by police and she doesn't bat an eye and later feels up her foster father, but gets better with therapy which she tells the main character later after they meet again in the Army or Marines and we never see her again after that.

My god this comment section.

In addition to everything else people have said here, his depiction of African-Americans as being exclusively species found in Africa (zebras, hyenas, etc.) got people labeling him as racist.

There's also his denials/claims about his sexuality. He did great females but comparatively he went overboard on the dicks and male anuses, putting like three times the amount of work and detail into them than anything else. He also has a fetish for uncut dicks, so the two of these combined ended up in his infamous "sand worm dicks" that so many people found disgusting.

Clearly, whether latently or not, he was expressing his attraction to men. But he fervently denied this. People tried to tell him it's okay for him to admit he was bi. There was more denial. This went on for years and eventually at some point he claimed he had been bi previously but was "cured" of it like it was a drug addiction. There's a lot more to it than that but that's what I remember off the top of my head at the moment, we're talking 25 year old furry history here. But basically he was acting like the stereotypical bi/gay Republican Christian in denial about his sexuality, and when he finally admits to it, he treats it like a disease he's been purged of. And then he goes right back to doing hyper-detailed dicks.

There's his fetish for cucking, cheating and infidelity that turned off a lot of people due to how often he puts it into his comics/stories. Hell, I'm pretty sure I learned the term "cucking" from discussions about his comics.

Then you've got his groupies that worship the ground he walks on and would viciously attack anyone criticizing him in any manner.

Naylor is pretty much a very good artist with some incredibly hot character designs wrapped in controversy, bigotry, ego, denials, and political mouthpiecing.

yuritaded said:
its sarcasm

Yeah, I think a lot of people are concentrating on the imagery of the snake without realizing instead of saying "Don't tread on me", it says "Say when", as in "Please tread on me."

druidelite said:
Why not just let people enjoy nice art?

because its the furry fandom and people will think politics has to do with EVERYTHING

fountainpen00 said:

A rapist is murdered in his hospital bed by buddies of the woman he raped and this is treated as an unambiguous good thing.

I mean, I don't see how that one is a bad thing. Setting aside kinks and whatnot, rapists are scum. You can argue it's vigilantism, and you would be correct but when the system won't punish the people who need it... well...

abnormalcybran said:
I mean, I don't see how that one is a bad thing. Setting aside kinks and whatnot, rapists are scum. You can argue it's vigilantism, and you would be correct but when the system won't punish the people who need it... well...

As I recall, the system didn't even get a chance to punish him (and both the detectives involved in the case and the victim were actively intending to pursue it towards a conviction). The rapist was casually "removed" from the picture by government agents who had been buddies of the victim's dead husband the day after while he was lying severely injured in his hospital bed (having been smacked around by a baseball bat in the middle of the rape). In essence, the system didn't get to fail (or succeed).

clawstripe said:
As I recall, the system didn't even get a chance to punish him (and both the detectives involved in the case and the victim were actively intending to pursue it towards a conviction). The rapist was casually "removed" from the picture by government agents who had been buddies of the victim's dead husband the day after while he was lying severely injured in his hospital bed (having been smacked around by a baseball bat in the middle of the rape). In essence, the system didn't get to fail (or succeed).

Admittedly, I don't know the context to this. If it was a real thing and Jay Naylor was commenting on it or if it was one of his comics.

abnormalcybran said:
Admittedly, I don't know the context to this. If it was a real thing and Jay Naylor was commenting on it or if it was one of his comics.

It was in one of his earlier comics set during his character Fisk's childhood.

abnormalcybran said:
I mean, I don't see how that one is a bad thing. Setting aside kinks and whatnot, rapists are scum. You can argue it's vigilantism, and you would be correct but when the system won't punish the people who need it... well...

Hence unambiguous good thing. Even if you could make the case that murdering him was the moral choice, it wouldn't be unambiguous. If it did look like the rapist was going to escape punishment and go on to rape again, then you could make an argument that killing him is the morally correct thing to do, but I still think that would be a grey area, and not "unambiguous."

But the comic treats it as, "heh!! gottem!! enjoy getting murdered, asshole!!" when it looked like this guy was set to be convicted as soon as he was discharged from the hospital. (I know you didn't have that last bit of context at the time.) So, yeah. Not great.

abnormalcybran said:
You can argue it's vigilantism, and you would be correct but when the system won't punish the people who need it... well...

And some nefarious people would use that excuse to punish innocent people because they saw them as criminals. Let's not forget that even if laws are mere rules we all agreed upon the morality is subjective and can vary from a person to another.

We are kinda supposed to be civilised, not barbarous about the way people are judged and punished, this is why public executions and torture are no longer a thing.

furtn said:
she's wearing a "don't tread on me" shirt please shut up

It's like seeing someone wear an "I AM LEFTIST" on a shirt, like jesus, leave it to conservatives to purposefully misinterpret something to their benefit

furtn said:

yuritaded said:
oh no! some one that doesnt agree with my far-left stalinist views oh the hummanity what ever will we do when people disagree with me!!!!!!!!!!

she's wearing a "don't tread on me" shirt please shut up

And? The only people who seem to hate Libertarians are Communists.

komradekommodore said:
she's wearing a "don't tread on me" shirt please shut up

And? The only people who seem to hate Libertarians are Communists.
[/quote]

No, everyone hates Libertarians. Anti-social NFT-hoarders aren't a particular popular group.

komradekommodore said:

And? The only people who seem to hate Libertarians are Communists.

Yeah nah, everyone hates Libertarians. The only reason they have notoriety is because Libertarian politicians/pundits treat it like the minor leagues before getting drafted to the Republicans. The only true believers are the obscenely rich who see everyone not in their tax bracket as beneath them, people who read "Atlas Shrugged" once and decided to base their entire personalities on it, and right-wing grifters who pay it lip service while pushing for more Republican policies.

To be fair, I hold them in the same respect as Tankies (Authoritarian Communists). Both see themselves as the ruling class in their ideal utopia (but for the most part will probably be sent to the re-education/labor camps along with everyone else), both think they are edgy and subversive intellectuals (while also having only a base understanding of the few books they've read, and also treat their interpretation as unquestionable gospel), and neither are aware of how even people that mostly align with them politically are laughing at them behind their backs (sometimes while the people who align with them closest are laughing in their faces).

As for Jay Naylor...

The worst part of Jay Naylor's art is that they're made by Jay Naylor.

Poorly hidden kinks that he swears he doesn't have. (I'm drawing cuck porn ironically! I only do it every other comic these days!)
Strawmen so bad that people actually agreed with the strawman, so he went out of his way to assassinate their character.
Pseudointellectualism like it hasn't already gone out of style.
The same "A-Political" writing you see in Daily Wire productions, except he was doing it first.
That time he made a comic about him finally looking for a girlfriend, but it's from the PoV of some of his female characters talking like his personal life is some big deal to his readers.
Thinking he cured himself of bisexualism, then continuing to draw the biggest, veiniest, uncuttiest cocks and closeups of men having their asses get eaten.
Making his obvious self-insert some badass wetwork operative that kills bad guys for 'murica, lost his virginity and killed a man before puberty, and is a totally awesome and cool dude that's super smart and handsome and always right about everything.

Like there's a lot of reasons not to like the guy without really getting into his politics. I don't count the Daily Wire writing or strawmen as political, because you see that on the left a lot too. (That webcomic about the trans kid where she would talk like a fully grown adult and only the worst kinds of people are antagonistic towards her, for one). But I'd be lying if I said that I don't occasionally see some of his art pop up and check it out without a second thought.

Can we get a “Don’t read the comments” tag?