Posted under Tag Alias and Implication Suggestions
The tag alias #70321 paused_comments -> invalid_tag has been approved.
Reason: Another attempt to circumvent the comments_disabled/disabled_comments/comments_closed/closed_comments/comments_locked/locked_comments invalidation (see topic #38089, topic #40051, & topic #43102).
EDIT: The tag alias paused_comments -> invalid_tag (forum #404744) has been approved by @Rainbow_Dash.
Updated by auto moderator
The bulk update request #8053 is active.
create alias comments_paused (0) -> invalid_tag (4)
Reason: Preemptive invalidation for the same reasons above.
EDIT: The bulk update request #8053 (forum #404746) has been approved by @Rainbow_Dash.
Updated by auto moderator
Aliasing these until the next one rolls around. I wonder what name it'll take? comments_deactivated?
Why are so many people trying to circumvent this particular tag? It makes literally no sense to me, it's not even an effective method of avoiding what people are trying to avoid, mostly just some random Martha Speaks images. Nobody's putting this much effort into bypassing the other often-complained-about things like TWYS gender tags, solo_(gender) or armpits.
snpthecat said:
Aliasing these until the next one rolls around. I wonder what name it'll take? comments_deactivated?
This can probably go on forever...
The tag alias paused_comments -> invalid_tag (forum #404744) has been approved by @Rainbow_Dash.
The bulk update request #8053 (forum #404746) has been approved by @Rainbow_Dash.
faucet said:
Why are so many people trying to circumvent this particular tag? It makes literally no sense to me, it's not even an effective method of avoiding what people are trying to avoid, mostly just some random Martha Speaks images. Nobody's putting this much effort into bypassing the other often-complained-about things like TWYS gender tags, solo_(gender) or armpits.
Before the tag creator got slapped for tagging abuse (and subsequently permabanned for ban evading), their profile wall mentioned that their rationale behind the tag was so that it could be blacklisted.
I suggested to them on a separate (now hidden) thread to blacklist the hot topic themes instead (e.g., politics) rather than to blacklist based on locked comments.
thegreatwolfgang said:
their profile wall mentioned that their rationale behind the tag was so that it could be blacklisted.
Same kind of argument that was brought up in topic #38089 as a "reason" to keep disabled_comments, which I still don't get the logic behind since most locks are temporary and the contents of the posts aren't themselves controversial
I still don't understand why it is necessary to continue aliasing all these tags away. If even just one person used it to blacklist something, then it is a useful tag. This is just a giant waste of time. I disagree with aliasing these all away because it's extremely likely that someone will create a tag that means the same thing. I find it quite annoying that there is no way to avoid this type of content. This is a giant waste of time and resources which could actually be used to improve the site.
hjfduitloxtrds said:
This is a giant waste of time and resources which could actually be used to improve the site.
???
hjfduitloxtrds said:
If even just one person used it to blacklist something, then it is a useful tag.
That's.. that's not how community driven tagging works. Tags are not for individual users, they should use sets if they want something just for them
I'd like to remind everyone that most posts that end up getting their comments locked are fairly innocuous, so what you're really trying to blacklist is the comments, which if you want that you can disable them entirely in your settings
These posts are some of the longest standing locks:
post #2903993 post #3336554 post #2410202 post #3331589 post #3341785
Why? Because shitty things happened in their comments. The actual content of the posts is just martha speaks, there's nothing in these posts worth blacklisting
Updated
donovan_dmc said:
That's.. that's not how community driven tagging works. Tags are not for individual users, they should use sets if they want something just for themI'd like to remind everyone that most posts that end up getting their comments locked are fairly innocuous, so what you're really trying to blacklist is the comments, which if you want that you can disable them entirely in your settings
These posts are some of the longest standing locks:
post #2903993 post #3336554 post #2410202 post #3331589 post #3341785 post #3343765Why? Because shitty things happened in their comments. The actual content of the posts is just martha speaks, there's nothing in this post worth blacklisting
The heck happened with martha speaks posts?
snpthecat said:
The heck happened with martha speaks posts?
A certain event in which there's video of the perpetrator looking at that first example, which caused trolls to come out of the woodwork on various martha speaks posts.
hjfduitloxtrds said:
I still don't understand why it is necessary to continue aliasing all these tags away. If even just one person used it to blacklist something, then it is a useful tag. This is just a giant waste of time. I disagree with aliasing these all away because it's extremely likely that someone will create a tag that means the same thing. I find it quite annoying that there is no way to avoid this type of content. This is a giant waste of time and resources which could actually be used to improve the site.
how much time do you think we spend on these
snpthecat said:
The heck happened with martha speaks posts?
Not sure about the comments, but a certain mass shooter (that shall not be named here) was known to have one of those posts in his Twitter(?) feed before the shooting. That's not actually relevant to the shooting, but I'm guessing it created a stir in the comments.
strikerman said:
how much time do you think we spend on these
that's what I'm saying
strikerman said:
how much time do you think we spend on these
A month, give or take a year
strikerman said:
how much time do you think we spend on these
wasted time is wasted time, whether it's 1 second or a whole lifetime, it's too much time. Especially when you consider the person who created the tag is extremely likely to replace it with something else. It's just a cat and mouse game at this point. Catch one, there'll be another one tomorrow. Really, I don't see another way of avoiding the locked comments. It particularly bothers me when I come across a locked comment section, especially when I'm just trying to downvote hateful or stupid comments and upvote the good ones. Is there another way to specifically avoid seeing posts with locked comments, or could one be created? A good workaround could be an alternative idea which would also stop these tags from being created in the first place. Also invalid_tag = :(
hjfduitloxtrds said:
Is there another way to specifically avoid seeing posts with locked comments, or could one be created?
We are very specifically not creating a metatag for this, it's excluded from the posts export and even api now, and the events are hidden
All of this information is very intentionally hidden and that isn't changing
The last two happened in e621ng/e621ng#507
hjfduitloxtrds said:
wasted time is wasted time, whether it's 1 second or a whole lifetime, it's too much time. Especially when you consider the person who created the tag is extremely likely to replace it with something else. It's just a cat and mouse game at this point. Catch one, there'll be another one tomorrow. Really, I don't see another way of avoiding the locked comments. It particularly bothers me when I come across a locked comment section, especially when I'm just trying to downvote hateful or stupid comments and upvote the good ones. Is there another way to specifically avoid seeing posts with locked comments, or could one be created? A good workaround could be an alternative idea which would also stop these tags from being created in the first place. Also invalid_tag = :(
Create a set and put the locked comments posts in it. Add -set:(set id) to your searches. There ya go
I have an idea. Use the arguments that follow said tags work as a honey pot. The smart ones will figure out to stop, the others will just find it very hard to comment any more? Note: Mostly joking as they do this sort of thing in computer security circles.
I nominate next tag: comment_riot
No wait, came_on_the_comments/come_for_the_comments.
Then we can ban boston_tea_comments. Because it was a riot, get it?
Yeah, OK, Dad Jokes aside, these tag names are almost as silly as what people have come up with.
Hmm, I wonder if someone should just block the comments from even displaying. I mean, if it bothers them so much.
e621.net###comments
You're welcome!
scaliespe said:
Create a set and put the locked comments posts in it. Add -set:(set id) to your searches. There ya go
Can't put them in your blacklist though, so you'll always have to append it to all your searches
Still can't believe the workaround is being advocated for by an admin though
snpthecat said:
Still can't believe the workaround is being advocated for by an admin though
If these people really want to hide their posts that's kinda their only option? We don't care what people do in set as long as it's legal, and we've already said countless times we aren't making a metatag or regular tag for this
"We are making it impossible to blacklist these posts." WHY IS THIS A GOOD IDEA????
hjfduitloxtrds said:
"We are making it impossible to blacklist these posts." WHY IS THIS A GOOD IDEA????
What conent are people avoiding by blacklisting this? It's not consistently on any specific type of content. If people want to avoid accidentally seeing rancid comments, well they're already removed.
regsmutt said:
What conent are people avoiding by blacklisting this? It's not consistently on any specific type of content. If people want to avoid accidentally seeing rancid comments, well they're already removed.
content with locked comments. Locked comments are annoying, and the reason these tags are created is to blacklist them, thus avoiding seeing them. It's not the actual post that's the problem, It's the very fact that the comments are locked that I find annoying, and there's no other way to completely avoid them without the blacklist. The fact that is not specifically on any types of content systematically means I can't just blacklist specific content because I would have to blacklist several tags and things i may actually want to see would also be blacklisted as well. I don't care that the comments themselves are "rancid", rather that they are locked.
hjfduitloxtrds said:
content with locked comments. Locked comments are annoying, and the reason these tags are created is to blacklist them, thus avoiding seeing them. It's not the actual post that's the problem, It's the very fact that the comments are locked that I find annoying, and there's no other way to completely avoid them without the blacklist. The fact that is not specifically on any types of content systematically means I can't just blacklist specific content because I would have to blacklist several tags and things i may actually want to see would also be blacklisted as well. I don't care that the comments themselves are "rancid", rather that they are locked.
You can blacklist individual posts if you don't want to use a set.
scaliespe said:
Create a set and put the locked comments posts in it. Add -set:(set id) to your searches. There ya go
I would have to specifically seek out and find the offending posts, which is nearly impossible because the tags which would identify them keep getting aliased away.
hjfduitloxtrds said:
which is nearly impossible because the tags which would identify them keep getting aliased away.
Yes, that's the idea
hjfduitloxtrds said:
content with locked comments. Locked comments are annoying, and the reason these tags are created is to blacklist them, thus avoiding seeing them. It's not the actual post that's the problem, It's the very fact that the comments are locked that I find annoying, and there's no other way to completely avoid them without the blacklist. The fact that is not specifically on any types of content systematically means I can't just blacklist specific content because I would have to blacklist several tags and things i may actually want to see would also be blacklisted as well. I don't care that the comments themselves are "rancid", rather that they are locked.
You're literally trying to blacklist something that is not part of the post. That isn't how blacklisting works.
hjfduitloxtrds said:
Locked comments are annoying
this is not good enough of a reason. we don't want these tags around because we want to limit ways to seek out controversy for users who would want to.
also like, honestly, what are even the chances of running into a comment locked post? there's like two, maybe three posts locked every quarter of a year and we get around 200k posts in the same span of time... can you really not handle the 0.0013% chance that you stumble onto a post that has locked comments? and, I mean, you haven't even commented on a post in that span of time anyway, so bring that chance right down to an even 0.0000% chance.
snpthecat said:
Can't put them in your blacklist though, so you'll always have to append it to all your searchesStill can't believe the workaround is being advocated for by an admin though
I was half-joking because it’s a silly request. There is nothing in those posts themselves that one would want to blacklist, they’re just trying to blacklist… the comments, which is not what blacklisting is for. You can just disable comments altogether if you don’t want to see comments. There simply doesn’t need to be a tag for blacklisting posts with bad comments sections.
On a more serious note, though, just blacklisting the individual post IDs would be the best solution. There are so few posts that this tag would apply to that it wouldn’t be that hard. This minor inconvenience for the… like, one, maybe two users on the whole site who actually want to blacklist this… is far outweighed by the benefits of making these posts specifically unsearchable. Comments get locked on posts specifically because those comments sections are drama magnets, so we really do not want people deliberately seeking them out.
To be brutally honest and perhaps unfairly so to others, I think the primary purpose of these tags is not to blacklist the posts but to make it easier to find them. Sure, there's likely a very small handful of Users who would want to avoid those comments, but they're far outweighed by the much larger group who are drawn to drama. Tags like these would be a magnet for them.
clawstripe said:
To be brutally honest and perhaps unfairly so to others, I think the primary purpose of these tags is not to blacklist the posts but to make it easier to find them. Sure, there's likely a very small handful of Users who would want to avoid those comments, but they're far outweighed by the much larger group who are drawn to drama. Tags like these would be a magnet for them.
With how offending comments are hidden, it's not particularly great for finding drama. I believe they would be far better off just going through order:comment_count (possibly with score:<0) and putting the correct posts in a set
You need to find a way to make locked comment sections unsearchable and yet hidden on the user end.
Invalidate the tags, yes, but I assume some amount of labor in coding was put towards creating an opt-out function in the UI for the uwu wordfilter, last month.
Perhaps an equal or somewhat greater amount could go toward an opt-out function for locked comments, in the Advanced Settings page and between Show Own Hidden Comments and Dmail Filter
People who want to see them still can, but without being able to search for them, because it's not a tag.
Everyone else can still go about the rest of the site without having to hide all comment sections, but every once in awhile when scrolling down, are met with a box that says they've chosen not to view locked comments.
This should more or less defeat the current argument that creating a tag could be used for blacklisting, hiding the offending content.
We have much more useful things that also don't have development time than an option than one or two people would use
And if it's so easy. Just do it yourself and see if your contribution gets merged. It's unlikely tho.
or make a userscript for it.
The GitHub repo is here.
https://github.com/e621ng/e621ng
And the API documentation is here
https://e621.net/help/api
