Uhm… okay?

Feel like this is not so nice to artists and as well to those who liked the art.

No warning? Advanced notice?

All those art pieces gone that people can probably no longer find anymore.

sylveon-z said:
Which laws exactly were changed that this change had to happen?

None. As you can see:
https://www.justice.gov/criminal/criminal-ceos/citizens-guide-us-federal-law-child-pornography

The law still only concerns itself with images depicting those indistinguishable from real, identifiable minors, not fictional ones.

nihet said:
Don't you guys enjoy how safer and more sterile internet is becoming? Can't post this, can't say that. I, for one, LOVE sitting in an empty grey room being advertised to. Safely.
Jokes aside, I fucking hate the destruction of art of any form. The tiny silver lining is, nothing was permadeleted and can be restored, at the very least. Still shitty how that happened without a warning.

I hate how the internet has become so corporate and bland, I have very hazy memories of the days of chocolate rain, numa numa, Tourette’s guy, and then much clearer memories of rage comics, team crafted, flash games and hell, even annoying orange, I hate how nowadays the advertisers and companies influence the culture and not the other way around, the way it should be, I miss the old internet. And I know why this is happening and it’s a little phenomenon called enshittification

musicw0lf said:
Huh, looks like I'm hypocritical asshole. I laughed that this content is removed, but I still like feral and some specific cub.

You learn something about yourself everyday.

The more you know

tsukiyomaruzero said:
I got a feeling that the next thing in the crosshair will be Sonic The Hedgehog, because NSFW servers on Discord already banned Sonic characters because they are underaged (even when the art depicts them aged up)

What? This is the first time I've heard this.

It's bizarre since Sega has actually removed the canon age of all Sonic characters a few years ago. And even in official games and animations, with the exception of Tails and Cream, the main characters are adult-coded.

tsukiyomaruzero said:
I got a feeling that the next thing in the crosshair will be Sonic The Hedgehog, because NSFW servers on Discord already banned Sonic characters because they are underaged (even when the art depicts them aged up)

Nah that's just cause everyone's universally accepted that not even porn can save sonic's career/reputation from where it is when compared to something like those Yoshi Island posts the auto mod saw Yoshi's bum and and baby mario in the same picture

carbisari said:
I absolutely loathe this cycle; this is another reminder to everyone that anything put online is easily lost.

Get an external hard drive if you don't have one already, and save your favorite art religiously in case of events like this one.

This. Makes me glad I've been doing just that for several years.
Anyone who wants to preserve their favs should install re621 & assign "download" to a key, makes it very fast and easy to favorite + download posts. And it even names them with the post ID, artist, characters, etc. down the tag list up to a certain character limit. Then just put it on a sufficiently sized disk.

pr34beta said:
Agreed, E621 has been degrading slowly in the past few months.

To be fair it’s amazing it’s been this bastion of free creativity and horniness has lasted as long as it has

fuyu_graycen said:
And that's what we're left with with all the major sites going schitzo mode and pressing the nuke

We are left with that for a place to archive

well, there's ExHentai, E-Hentai's rule-less other half. I don't even think that website has any direct revenue at all, since it dosn't even run any ads, let alone require payment.

warioanon said:
I hope Midna stays safe, she's definitely not young but she is quite short

I checked and there's a LOT of Midna stuff deleted. Why...

0mnm652 said:
What sullies our name is the fact that by counting drawings and other fiction as CP, our legal system has rejected literally the single most important tenet a legal system can have, namely the distinction between reality and fiction.
That is more important than the right to freedom of speech. More important than the right to a fair trial. More important than presumption of innocence until proven guilty. Because none of those rights mean anything if the government can point to something that never happened, that they know never happened, that you know never happened, and that you would not want to have happened, and say "we choose to pretend this happened and will apply those rights through the filter of pretending it had happened".
"Proven guilty" ceases to have any significance if the "proof" can be a literal fairy tale.

Sad, I know. However, that is the way our system of government is designed. We do not have rights, nor freedoms in this country. We have privileges that are selectively applied depending on the current government's beliefs. It's certainly a bad thing when the government is allowed to selectively choose which things are covered under a "right" and which aren't, but I'd much rather it happen to something like this than what has happened with the rest of our rights within the last 10 years. Absolute freedom is great, but it does not function in real life, every country must draw a line where something is free and something isn't, we draw the line at this type of stuff and it would be a good idea for every person who says "If this keeps up, I'm moving to Canada" to research our laws and government first to realise the USA is much better for keeping your rights than here.

People should know that the art they wanna see will be much harder to access here than there.

What exactly do you mean by humanoid like? like anthros are already humanoid and there's a bunch of humanoid pokemon and digimon and whatever there is out there

and what about small humanoids that aren't actually young? like what if someones oc is just small in general but its not a young character and similar thing to small pokemon

No warning though? Countless false positives gone as well. Nice.

no more young humanoid nsfw? ok so that means no more cream the rabbit or tails, right? except im seeing plenty of humanoid characters still in the loli tag which includes cream, but its fine because theyre fully furry? because theyre sonic characters? kyle hill's most recent video about the internet being dead feels more and more true every time shit like this happens.

Waiting for a torrent of those ~50k deleted works, since they aren't illegal or anything. It would be a NICE GESTURE.

aspy_dragon said:
I hate how the internet has become so corporate and bland, I have very hazy memories of the days of chocolate rain, numa numa, Tourette’s guy, and then much clearer memories of rage comics, team crafted, flash games and hell, even annoying orange, I hate how nowadays the advertisers and companies influence the culture and not the other way around, the way it should be, I miss the old internet. And I know why this is happening and it’s a little phenomenon called enshittification

I primarily blame the cheap smartphone revolution of the early 2010s. That bashed down the skill and price barriers to the Internet by suddenly introducing hundreds of millions of utterly unaccustomed people to an existing ecosystem and making it fit THEM. They came in at a time when social media was also exploding as well, so you have tons of people online who never learned to separate the Internet from real life re-dictating the flow of Internet etiquette.

It's Over

greatwhitetrillium said:
Sad, I know. However, that is the way our system of government is designed. We do not have rights, nor freedoms in this country. We have privileges that are selectively applied depending on the current government's beliefs. It's certainly a bad thing when the government is allowed to selectively choose which things are covered under a "right" and which aren't, but I'd much rather it happen to something like this than what has happened with the rest of our rights within the last 10 years. Absolute freedom is great, but it does not function in real life, every country must draw a line where something is free and something isn't, we draw the line at this type of stuff and it would be a good idea for every person who says "If this keeps up, I'm moving to Canada" to research our laws and government first to realise the USA is much better for keeping your rights than here.

People should know that the art they wanna see will be much harder to access here than there.

The people that made the USA didn't "threaten" to merely move, just saying

popplio said:
What exactly do you mean by humanoid like?

Don't expect an answer. If what has/hasn't been removed is any indication, nobody knows. Not even the staff. At this point it really seems like they just let the automod shoot blind at anything that might be tagged young and human, but not all of it. It appears highly arbitrary.

edu2703 said:
What? This is the first time I've heard this.

It's bizarre since Sega has actually removed the canon age of all Sonic characters a few years ago. And even in official games and animations, with the exception of Tails and Cream, the main characters are adult-coded.

I edited my post to clarify it, but long story short it was Discord Admins growing paranoid that underage fictional character art is the same as underage real life pornography and that the FBI could get on their asses.

Funny enough, one other gallery site that used to ban manga/comics containing underaged characters within MINUTES from them being uploaded started allowing them in... Shamefully that dame gallery also allows AI fart.

bizymouse said:
Waiting for a torrent of those ~50k deleted works, since they aren't illegal or anything. It would be a NICE GESTURE.

Absolutely, shit not being archived or preserved at all bugs me. Sure, it probably exists somewhere else.

But you gotta ask at what point does something still “exist” when mediums to host its existence cease to host it?

This is... extremely concerning. I may not like that kind of content, but there has never been a case where this isn't a slippery slope.

Considering there wasnt an immediate need to pull them, and they were all given the same tag for removal, it would have been nice to have been able to archive them before they just suddenly disappeared.

cumwizard said:
I primarily blame the cheap smartphone revolution of the early 2010s. That bashed down the skill and price barriers to the Internet by suddenly introducing hundreds of millions of utterly unaccustomed people to an existing ecosystem and making it fit THEM. They came in at a time when social media was also exploding as well, so you have tons of people online who never learned to separate the Internet from real life re-dictating the flow of Internet etiquette.

That and the corporations couldn’t resist the urge to taint this (at the time) completely new and untamed world known as the internet

who are these unmentionable "business partners" that cant be named?

tsukiyomaruzero said:
I edited my post to clarify it, but long story short it was Discord Admins growing paranoid that underage fictional character art is the same as underage real life pornography and that the FBI could get on their asses.

And yet they have no problem with real people using Discord to abuse real children en-masse with the platform at rates unprecedented. Nope, drawings of a silly Sega video game about cartoon animals fighting robots is the crisis.

hiddenviewer said:
Considering there wasnt an immediate need to pull them, and they were all given the same tag for removal, it would have been nice to have been able to archive them before they just suddenly disappeared.

I agreed

supersecretunknown said:
no more young humanoid nsfw? ok so that means no more cream the rabbit or tails, right? except im seeing plenty of humanoid characters still in the loli tag which includes cream, but its fine because theyre fully furry? because theyre sonic characters? kyle hill's most recent video about the internet being dead feels more and more true every time shit like this happens.

Its a little vague, but they give examples so I suppose because the character is completely covered in fur, it doesn't count as human-like. The human-like tag seems to apply to characters that have bare skin without animal shaped limbs

So, art of a human having sexual intercourse with an anthropomorphic animal is getting removed as well?

lendrimujina said:
This is... extremely concerning. I may not like that kind of content, but there has never been a case where this isn't a slippery slope.

This, also the tik tok ban, it seems like we’re gonna need to make a new form of instant communication of ideas and information and protect it form corporations at all costs, a new internet, one like the internet of old

warioanon said:
The people that made the USA didn't "threaten" to merely move, just saying

Exactly my point. The USA is founded on an idea of not budging. So I think they should fight for their rights instead of saying they are gonna go to Canada.

aspy_dragon said:
I hate how the internet has become so corporate and bland, I have very hazy memories of the days of chocolate rain, numa numa, Tourette’s guy, and then much clearer memories of rage comics, team crafted, flash games and hell, even annoying orange, I hate how nowadays the advertisers and companies influence the culture and not the other way around, the way it should be, I miss the old internet. And I know why this is happening and it’s a little phenomenon called enshittification

It's a trainwreck and not getting any better. Yes, father Advertiser, I absolutely NEED to see ads about your accounting phone app and funeral service when I browse my big furry penis websites, thank you very much.

greatwhitetrillium said:
Its a little vague, but they give examples so I suppose because the character is completely covered in fur, it doesn't count as human-like. The human-like tag seems to apply to characters that have bare skin without animal shaped limbs

Except the rules are by appearance.
If they look human and there's no fur texture, whether that's supposed to be fur or not doesn't matter.

greatwhitetrillium said:
Exactly my point. The USA is founded on an idea of not budging. So I think they should fight for their rights instead of saying they are gonna go to Canada.

Not that Canada is any better in this particular regard anyway.

Well this is the beginning of the end for this site.

stratozara said:
who are these unmentionable "business partners" that cant be named?

This has already been addressed; the staff has no reason to disclose this information, and really quite a few reasons to not disclose it. Awful as the situation is, the last thing they need is for people to go harass an entity who is evidently influential enough to cause this awful situation.

FWIF, despite what some people are saying, this apparently doesn't have anything to do with advertising. So it's presumably a hosting problem. Not that it makes things a whole lot better, but at least we can be fairly sure that the consequences of the staff rejecting this pressure would be less "No more advertising money for E621!" and more "No more E621!"

greatwhitetrillium said:
Exactly my point. The USA is founded on an idea of not budging. So I think they should fight for their rights instead of saying they are gonna go to Canada.

thats cute that you think a bunch of pornographers are going to fight for whats right and not cave inmediately the moment they can make 1 extra dollar out of whatever demands are made of them.

warioanon said:
And yet they have no problem with real people using Discord to abuse real children en-masse with the platform at rates unprecedented. Nope, drawings of a silly Sega video game about cartoon animals fighting robots is the crisis.

It's ridiculous, and... I can't help but feel these decisions are purely political and done on impulse, without consideration for the repercussion it will have on the long run.

If this is about money, they could just set up a patreon for donations, it doesn’t take a rocket scientist to figure it out, maybe the perks could just be like a user flair or something that says, hey we recognize that you’re helping keep this site up or something

im going to break my rule of never commenting on this site to say that this is actually bad

lendrimujina said:
Not that Canada is any better in this particular regard anyway.

Well yeah, I've been saying that Canada is nice, but worse when it comes to freedom. Especially when it comes to artistic freedom. It's much harder to fight for our rights here because the opening of our charter states that the rights are able to be selectively applied, while in the USA the constitution is much stronger and holds more power, so things like this can be fought.

aspy_dragon said:
If this is about money, they could just set up a patreon for donations, it doesn’t take a rocket scientist to figure it out, maybe the perks could just be like a user flair or something that says, hey we recognize that you’re helping keep this site up or something

Plus this is the furry community we're talking about. A community known for lots of suspiciously wealthy participants, lol.

aspy_dragon said:
If this is about money, they could just set up a patreon for donations, it doesn’t take a rocket scientist to figure it out, maybe the perks could just be like a user flair or something that says, hey we recognize that you’re helping keep this site up or something

Patreon also doesn't allow loli, so they would get taken down. Happened to me.

this sucks ass lol

good.. i cant stand underage stuff anyway
its for the best.. out children are our future

stratozara said:
thats cute that you think a bunch of pornographers are going to fight for whats right and not cave inmediately the moment they can make 1 extra dollar out of whatever demands are made of them.

Not saying I expect them to, and I'm not saying they will (Though they did manage to fight the other proposed bill which was going to make this site completely dead), all I'm saying is Canada isn't the option if this is the type of stuff you want since its been banned for almost 40 years and there is a bill now which wants to make it harder to access.

tailpoker said:
good.. i cant stand underage stuff anyway
its for the best.. out children are our future

our fictional children?...

Just... can you promise that there isn't a foreseeable significant risk of going full FurAffinity about this? I don't exactly have the type of hyperrealistic art style new policies like the ones that place adopted require.

waba said:
Anyways, was this because the servers are hosted in Arizona? I've heard that Arizona was also discussing about implementing those "online child safety" laws like they did in North Carolina and straight-up banning sites but I don't know what the outcome of that was. Sounds like a "We gotta protect our own asses now so that the government doesn't come after us in the future" type of move, hence the rush.

Is moving the servers not an option?

Just to clear this up, since it's come up a lot.

The server location is not the biggest factor. Although yes, the server is located in the US, this change would have happened regardless of where we were hosted. As Nim said, there were many other factors at play here.

tailpoker said:
good.. i cant stand underage stuff anyway
its for the best.. out children are our future

Fictional children are not our future.

Yeah, the organizations driving these changes aren't going to back down now that their strong-arm tactics have been proven to work once again. I wouldn't be surprised if cub or realistic feral were next on the chopping block.

jasowan said:
So, art of a human having sexual intercourse with an anthropomorphic animal is getting removed as well?

Unironically my worst nightmare.

rainbow_dash said:
Just to clear this up, since it's come up a lot.

The server location is not the biggest factor. Although yes, the server is located in the US, this change would have happened regardless of where we were hosted. As Nim said, there were many other factors at play here.

bad

stratozara said:
who are these unmentionable "business partners" that cant be named?

Even if Dragonfru.it isn't under any NDA with the partner in question (And almost everyone is, these days), this is not a question you can expect an answer for and for two different reasons.
A) If they were both erratic enough, and then financially involved enough with e621's parent company, to make this demand and have it seen through this immediately, then following the logic they've demonstrated so far, then being named now, in the middle of this hostility, they would pull the support they were promising to continue giving if the uploads in question were deleted.
B) It's shitty, kind of unethical, and it would only lead to harrassment when, again, it might not have been their choice either, like it was not entirely e621's choice.

This is why I was asking earlier if XXXXXX was based in a state that just passed a law that effectively labeled them as a financial backer of illegal pornography.

Just upload lolis being executed for the crime of existence. That'll appease them.

Why do they always sell out, dragonfruit is so obscenely horribly money hungry its unreal.
Time to somewhere with principals

This also might be a dumb question. Does human looking count goblins and other creatures that does look somewhat human but has not human colours like green?

Or demons that are grey or read but with tails, long pointy ears or horns or a combination?

I mean, if there's one vague "upside" to all of this, it's that people who like furrification and aging up characters are going to be eating like kings, what with artists who want their art to be able to be posted here now having to change their drawings to incorporate cub aesthetics/aging up to accommodate the new rules.
Everyone else suffers though, especially the shortstack fans and people who prefer on-model Pokemon, Digimon and the like, they're pretty much boned unless they're open to the idea of off-model Kirlia with massive milkers or true-form Midna. Plus this whole thing can very much indicate a decline into potential purging of more content like feral or other such taboo content depending on future circumstances.

notmenotyou said:
Greetings!

We've got a doozy this time.
Due to challenges stemming from changes in the political and legal environment, both offline and online, we have had to adjust our content guidelines to preserve access to our site. As a result, any content featuring young human or humanoid characters in explicit situations is now prohibited and will be deleted. This change also applies retroactively, and we have already removed all existing submissions featuring such content.

As with all irrelevant content, we will not issue records for uploads that violate this policy; the content will simply be deleted.

Thank you for your understanding, as this was not an easy decision for us to make.

Ah it sounds like the Evangelical church is at it again with their crusade to “cleanse” the Wild West of the Internet (they’ll eventually realize it’s a losing battle) and their battle ground is payment processors, some updates to FOSTA AND SESTA that killed several other sites, or with it being an election year the geriatric candidates are doing their best to make a rally cry against anything that will win them the public’s favor while casting aside the fact that fictional works are and should be protected by the first amendment if this site is hosted in America which I’m assuming it is.

notmenotyou said:
Guess what put pressure on some of our partners?

That's right, governments.

Guess who would like to continue doing business in places where those governments are?

That's right, our business partners.

which governments? local? state? federal?
which partners? bad dragon? anthrocon?

be more specific please

friedy said:
So you're just straight up deleting works of artists, who're not from America's shitty political climate, who does this stuff without even warning them at least?

there's probably artist who no longer post heir stuff anywhere anymore or have died which now their stuff is about to be gone forever without giving anyone a chance to archive it

toradrow777 said:
If things get any worse, I'm thinking of moving to Canada.

they will throw you in to jail for that over there

Just say it's a kneejerk reaction because of local laws where the server is hosted
RIP loli cat girls

espenebs said:
This also might be a dumb question. Does human looking count goblins and other creatures that does look somewhat human but has not human colours like green?

Or demons that are grey or read but with tails, long pointy ears or horns or a combination?

The Midna and Kirlia tags have already been swept, so I'd say "yes".

dragonfaun said:
Ah it sounds like the Evangelical church is at it again with their crusade to “cleanse” the Wild West of the Internet (they’ll eventually realize it’s a losing battle) and their battle ground is payment processors, some updates to FOSTA AND SESTA that killed several other sites, or with it being an election year the geriatric candidates are doing their best to make a rally cry against anything that will win them the public’s favor while casting aside the fact that fictional works are and should be protected by the first amendment if this site is hosted in America which I’m assuming it is.

All this is gonna do is just move everyone underground and into Black markets more. They're not solving any problems they are just pushing it away from the public eye.

anormaluser said:
3 years later
We've got a doozy this time.
Due to challenges stemming from changes in the political and legal environment, we will be removing all furry art (yucky degenerates!) from the site...

6 years later
Hey so it turns out all art is bad, so...

espenebs said:
This also might be a dumb question. Does human looking count goblins and other creatures that does look somewhat human but has not human colours like green?

Or demons that are grey or read but with tails, long pointy ears or horns or a combination?

Goblins and Draenei are gone, that should answer your question.

rainbow_dash said:
Just to clear this up, since it's come up a lot.

The server location is not the biggest factor. Although yes, the server is located in the US, this change would have happened regardless of where we were hosted. As Nim said, there were many other factors at play here.

I really, really, really wanna give you guys the benefit of the doubt on this, and I understand the mindset of needing to say something, anything to quell the rumor mill. But you guys gotta realize that with maybe one exception, none of the responses we've thus far gotten from the admin staff have made this situation any better. Every time you guys try to address concerns, this weird vagueness just raises several more. It's one thing to be under pressure for time when the trigger was pulled on this, and deciding to sort it out later. But honestly I feel like, at this point, it may be better for you guys to really collect yourselves and both figure out what you can/can't tell us, then let the community know what those things are without this ambiguity. Because so far it feels like every single response we've seen needs a "*wink wink*" at the end.

notmenotyou said:
There is no single law we can point to as the tipping point

So point at the multiple laws, please.

Haven't posted in the forums for a while but all I'm gonna say is that I fear that cub and feral will be next. I mean, I genuinely don't see your business partners and advertisers stopping at only human underage. Sooner or later all "freak shit" will be obliterated from the site, if not all NSFW completely. Really disappointed.